Mayor Andrew Ginther

Tim Fulton 0:12Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Confluence Cast presented by Columbus Underground. We are a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. This week, Columbus Underground reporter Lauren Sega sat down with Columbus Mayor Andrew Ginther, who's currently running unopposed for re-election. They discussed his proudest achievements as mayor for the last four years, his goals for the city during his next term, and the delicate balance of policing properly by enacting a variety of new initiatives. You can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Also, the Confluence Cast is on Patreon. Find out how to support this podcast on our website, theconfluencecast.com or at patreon.com/confluence. The Confluence Cast is sponsored this week by Little Rock Bar. Little Rock Bar is located at 944 North Fourth Street in Italian Village. With 30 beers on tap, Little Rock Bar has happy hour from 4:00 to 7:00 PM every day. Every Tuesday, get $3 draft beers all night. Wednesdays is Everybody's a Comedian, hosted by Travis Haywicher. It's like trivia, but you prove your snark instead of smarts. Info, hours, and upcoming events at littlerockbar.net. Everyone's night should have a little rock. Enjoy the interview.

Lauren Sega 1:50So yeah, you've been in public office for a while versus Board of Education and-

Andrew Ginther 1:55Mm-hmm

Lauren Sega 1:55... councils. How do you feel like being mayor has changed the way you've been a public servant?

Andrew Ginther 2:02It's definitely brought me even closer, uh, to the people of Columbus and Central Ohio. And, and there are many things I've learned. I learn things all the time because I screw things up pretty, uh- ... uh, often because we're trying new things, and we're trying to do things differently and improve upon things that we've done in the past. It's not failure if you learn from it, and I learn something every day as mayor. But one of the things I've really experienced is, um, the incredible people of this community. Uh, there are not many places in the country you go where everybody is rooting for the city's success, even people who don't live and work in the city. I mean, you have people who live in Dublin, Upper Arlington, and Grove City, Plain City, you know, uh, that want Columbus to succeed-

Lauren Sega 2:46Mm-hmm

Andrew Ginther 2:46... uh, and are rooting for us and wanna do their part, uh, to help Columbus succeed, and that is pretty unique for a community. Maybe more common for a smaller town-

Lauren Sega 2:55Mm-hmm

Andrew Ginther 2:55... but not the 14th largest city in the country and a city that's gonna grow by another third, uh, and region that's gonna grow by another third over the next 30 years. So that has been an incredible, uh, experience because folks are consistently asking me, whether it's mobility, neighborhood development, Celebrate One, uh, and some of the other work that we're doing, "What can I do? How can I be part of your vision for, uh, making Columbus a better place where there's more shared prosperity and success?"

Lauren Sega 3:28Right. Well, I know that when you were sworn in, you, you kinda laid out these priorities that you had, number one specifically being neighborhood development.

Andrew Ginther 3:35Yeah.

Lauren Sega 3:35Since then, I know that you've rolled out, you know, One Linden, the, the Glenwood, uh, Recreation Center went up in the Hilltop.

Andrew Ginther 3:41Yeah.

Lauren Sega 3:41What kind of tangible, visible, positive changes have you seen in those neighborhoods since you were sworn in?

Andrew Ginther 3:47I think a number of things. Obviously, um, significant public investment in infrastructure if you look at it, infrastructure that's seen and unseen because a lotta people don't necessarily realize the millions and millions of dollars we're investing in the hidden infrastructure and water, sewer. And, um, you look at the investments we've made into opportunity neighborhoods, so that's Hilltop, Linden, Merion Franklin, North Linden. You know, in essence, the third of our neighbors that have been left out thus far-

Lauren Sega 4:14Yeah

Andrew Ginther 4:14... in Columbus's juggernaut success story. So you look at those, and then you look at, you know, some of the social determinants of health. I mean, Linden, uh, had the highest infant mortality rate when we started the Celebrate One work, quite honestly, before I was mayor. It is now not the highest. It is still way too high, and we're working, uh, you know, particularly looking at it through the, um, lens of race, the racial disparity. We've actually had infant mortality come below, uh... We've, uh, met and exceeded our goal for a reduction in infant mortality amongst white, uh, infants, which makes the disparity even greater with African Americans. And so really being very focused, purposeful, and intentional on making sure that Celebrate One and all of our partners are particularly focused on going after that racial disparity at this point and doubling down on things that we're doing, particularly within the African American community.

Lauren Sega 5:07Right. And I'm curious 'cause y- you're aware that race is a factor, a big factor. Um, so what have you done specifically to make sure that Black women's voices and perspectives and needs and experiences are considered when- forming new policies?

Andrew Ginther 5:24Uh, y- y- you're absolutely right. Uh, part of that is having the great leadership that we have with Erica Clark Jones there heading up Celebrate, uh, One, and having outstanding leaders like Priam Choksi, uh, heading up our neighborhood engagement. Women who, uh, have a feel for the pulse of the community, particularly of African American women and women of color. But also with the, the work that we're doing around our neighborhood health workers. We really have identified and recruited primarily women, I think we've had two men, that have become neighborhood health workers, community health workers, uh, through the Celebrate One effort. But we go and recruit women from the neighborhood. So overwhelmingly women of color, African American women, who have much more credibility, quite honestly, than me, the health commissioner, or other institutional types. But women who can work directly with other women of color in the neighborhood. And we also have engaged the faith community, because oftentimes women of color that have an unexpected pregnancy, uh, they may be thrown out of their home, particularly if they're, uh, a teen and may be couch surfing with friends. And so having, you know, a motherly or grandmotherly type within a congregation or a faith tradition within a community can kinda be that adopted mentor and friend. So involving them in becoming safe sleep ambassadors and working, uh, with Dee Malu- with Dee Malone who heads up that workforce, has really made a difference. But you're absolutely right. How are we connecting with and communicating with African American women, is what we're really focused on now. And that's why we're expanding our home visitation program. Uh, and our hope is, in partnership with the state, uh, Governor DeWine has made this one of his very top priorities, and our goal with recommendations he's supposed to give back in the next month or so is partner with them. We have all the health systems working together. We've gone from an evidence-informed home visitation delivery system to an evidence-based, so higher standards that's been evaluated and tested in multiple communities that has been shown to be far more effective. The entire health system community and public health are working together, uh, with women, uh, to deliver those services, which we know are so critically important. You look at all the research. And making sure, uh, those relationships start before baby is born and then continue afterwards, connecting with resources for high-quality, uh, childcare, early learning opportunities. This kind of birth to five space. My vision is for our community to become a national leader in the birth to five space, since that work starts with Celebrate One and then leads ultimately to kindergarten readiness, uh, at the age of five.

Lauren Sega 7:59So I'm curious, and we don't have to spend this whole conversation talking about infant mortality-

Andrew Ginther 8:02Sure

Lauren Sega 8:02... although, you know, I could.

Andrew Ginther 8:03Yeah.

Lauren Sega 8:04Um, I'm curious as to how healthcare systems are implementing cultural competency in a way that specifically addresses the distrust that Afric- the African American community has toward doctors, towards hospitals.

Andrew Ginther 8:16Well, I don't wanna speak exclusively-

Lauren Sega 8:17That situation

Andrew Ginther 8:17... for the health systems, but, you know, a lot of that work has been done, um, through the Central Ohio, uh, Hospital Association working with Celebrate One, taking the lead from, uh, great partners like Moms2B and some other, other partners that we have in the community that are working directly with expecting moms.

Lauren Sega 8:34Right.

Andrew Ginther 8:34Disproportionately, uh, women of color and African American women in particular. And sharing that information with healthcare providers. Uh, and that's why the, the Step One, uh, coalition and, and partnership's been so important. Used to be we had, for referrals for women who needed prenatal care, it was kind of a disconnected and under-resourced system. Now they can call, uh, one number to get connected to a, a doctor, get in to see that doctor right away. Uh, provided support throughout their pregnancy. Smart Columbus is gonna be, has been working very closely with the health systems and Step One, uh, and we're gonna be unveiling a prenatal, uh, mobility, uh, service, uh, option, uh, through Smart Columbus later this year, where expecting moms are gonna be able to access on-demand, uh, mobility service options to get to doctor's appointments, pharmacies, access to fresh fruits and vegetables, workforce development, childcare if they have older children. That's another way that we're working together with the health systems, uh, the healthcare community, and Smart Columbus to help women have healthier pregnancies and have their children thrive in their earliest years of life.

Lauren Sega 9:47Well, we know that what affects health, part of what affects health is perceived safety.

Andrew Ginther 9:52Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 9:52Perceived safety in your neighborhood, in your home. And the way the city achieves public safety has been under scrutiny.

Andrew Ginther 9:58Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 9:59What methods and techniques are, should be used-

Andrew Ginther 10:03Mm

Lauren Sega 10:03... to guarantee public safety? Um, in the last five years, Columbus Police have killed several dozen-

Andrew Ginther 10:08Mm

Lauren Sega 10:08... citizens, the majority of whom were Black.

Andrew Ginther 10:11Yeah.

Lauren Sega 10:11I mean, just in December, two Black teens were killed-

Andrew Ginther 10:13Mm

Lauren Sega 10:13... on a sting attempt to, uh, find armed robbers. Those techniques, Columbus Police are standing behind.

Andrew Ginther 10:19Mm.

Lauren Sega 10:19Members of the Black community have rallied inside and outside City Hall to protest the killing of their community members. What is your response to that?

Andrew Ginther 10:27Well, we take it very seriously. And, and that's why we formed the Community Safety Advisory Commission that's made up of, uh, it's led by a former judge and city attorney, and CEO of the United Way, Janet Jackson. It's made up of folks from across the community, faith leaders and other folks, some of whom have actually led some of those protests. And, uh, and then others that, um, have been involved in law enforcement issues for a long period of time, to look at all of our policies and procedures. We're working with independent consultant Matrix that's helped looked at divisions of police of other major departments around, um, not just, uh, the United States, but North America. And looking at, um, how we evaluate, recruit, train, uh, and hold, uh, our division of police accountable. My Top priority is to make sure the Division of Police is responsive, uh, accountable, and transparent. And that's why the first major initiative that, uh, I led was body-worn cameras. And not only have we implemented that strategy, uh, very successfully, uh, ahead of schedule, on budget, uh, by working with the state legislature in a bipartisan way, we now have what's being called a best practice, uh, a case study for transparency with both the Newspaper Association, the FOP, Republicans, Democrats putting in place some of the standards and requirements around footage of body-worn cameras. And we always knew that our officers having body-worn cameras would make the officers and the people that they have sworn to, uh, protect and serve would be safer, and I think that has, has led to some good things. The implicit bias training that the chief, the former chief mandated and received national attention for, the ramping up of those that have the crisis intervention training, specifically how to deal with folks who might have mental health challenges and that, uh, are gonna need a different approach when law enforcement, uh, you know, arrives on the scene. Every one of our officers that goes through the academy now receives that training, and we made a commitment to have 50% of our patrol trained in that, so folks that have been on the force for decades and decades that haven't received it, 50% of our outward-facing officers by 2020. And that's another significant commitment and response that we've made based on folks from, you know, a variety of different organizations that we work with and meet with consistently. But one of the things that I've said, and one of the reasons I fought so hard as we launched this national search, uh, for a new chief of police, is that we want a chief who's committed to not just policing more, but policing differently, using our officers in ways that we have not historically, more community policings. That's why I've expanded the Safe Streets program. And when you look at the comprehensive neighborhood safety strategy that we unveiled after the homicide spike in 2017, it is a much more comprehensive approach to public safety. It's not just a law enforcement, more police officers response. We have Neighborhood Health, uh, Public Health, the Department of Neighborhoods, Recreation and Parks, nonprofit organizations that are all working together to implement a comprehensive strategy to make our neighborhoods safety, uh, safer. So you have Neighborhood Crisis Response, the Violent Crime Review Group, expansion of programming by Recreation and Parks, and all of that together, I think, has helped us realize a significant reduction in homicides and violent crime. You know, we continue to expand. This year we're gonna, based on council's adoption of the budget, expand the duration of that Safe Streets, the bike patrol program in the three neighborhoods. We've launched ShotSpotter in, uh, the Hilltop and are gonna be moving that to the Southside and Linden as well. That's a gunfire detection system that has proved very, very successful in Baltimore, Pittsburgh, and Cincinnati, because we know nationally 80% of gunshots go unreported. And so it does two things. First of all, officers aren't aware of what's taking place in neighborhoods, and then the residents of that neighborhood think that police officers don't care because nobody responded because it wasn't reported.

Lauren Sega 14:39Right.

Andrew Ginther 14:39Uh, and so that's another tool to speak to that. But we look forward to the recommendations coming back from Matrix, from additional changes that, uh, we can make as a division. And I know part of that is increasing the diversity of our police officers and firefighters, and that's why I charged the safety director to double the number of officers and firefighters of, of color and women over the next decade. And I think if you look at the last two police classes and the last two fire classes, they were both, um, some of the most diverse, but also the highest scoring classes that we've had in those divisions' history. That's gonna need to... We're gonna have to do that over the next 10 years consistently and aggressively to, uh, meet my goal, but I think we're, we're headed in the direction, the right direction.

Lauren Sega 15:29Mm-hmm. Those are great initiatives.

Andrew Ginther 15:30Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 15:31Um, police-involved killings still happen. Is there a priority at all to establish a third party that would investigate these things? Because at m- current moment, the police are kind of just investigating themselves, and I know that the, that's a concern that the community has, has expressed and-

Andrew Ginther 15:46Well, and I think that's why the Safety Advisory Commission is so important. And, you know, we're gonna look at recommendations that come from that group and from Matrix, and maybe there, uh, is something that they're gonna recommend that folks feel better about. There are some, uh, folks that would like to see changes to the grand jury process. Obviously, that has to take place at the state level. Uh, and I know I've talked with legislators who have an interest in making that public, uh, and having that process be more transparent than it is currently so that, you know, folks are held accountable based on what takes place there. It is very much, for a lot of folks, the grand jury process, grand jury process can be very secretive and an unknown process as to what takes place in there, how those things come about, and why some people feel as if there have not been accountability, uh, in place, uh, for officers that have gone through that before.

Lauren Sega 16:43So you mentioned that, uh, the national search for a new police chief.

Andrew Ginther 16:46Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 16:47Um, you said that, uh, you're looking for someone who will police differently. Do you have any specifics that you'd like to elude on?

Andrew Ginther 16:51Well, part of that is someone that's gonna take, um, the resources we have currently. I mean, the end of this year, we're gonna have more police officers on the street than any time in the city's history. There have been some people in law enforcement that say we should have a lot more officers and, uh, you know, we've hired a, a, a good amount of police officers. That's how we got to this highest r- you know, level, and we also have the most firefighters That we've ever had in our city's history, uh, which is great, but now we need to use our resources differently to better protect and serve the public. And so I want more officers, you know, assigned not just simply to calls for service, but community policing, proactive community-based policing, the way that our safe streets, you know, ideally I'd like that going on throughout the city, not just in the, the Hilltop and Linden and the Southside, but in neighborhoods throughout the city. And I think the, the, the minority recruitment unit is under great new leadership there that has dramatically improved and increased the amount of candidates that are coming into the classes and that are sticking with it during the program, because it's not just showing up for a test, it's an entire process-

Lauren Sega 17:58Right

Andrew Ginther 17:58... that takes place that we need to be seeing through that. And I think it's gonna be someone that is committed to changing, uh, the culture within the division of police. One that is, uh, gonna be willing to take the lead to have the division, uh, become a much more reform-minded, innovative, and community-minded place. I think they're... The culture of the division of police needs to be, I think, brought into the 21st century, and needs to better meet and exceed the community's expectations of today.

Lauren Sega 18:38I guess I, I wanna follow that up with, like, are you looking at any other cities t- to model that off of?

Andrew Ginther 18:42There are lots of... So Matrix has worked with, uh, cities around the country. I don't think there's any one city. Columbus is, is different. It's unique. There are things that we'll probably take from several cities, and as I had outlined in our comprehensive neighborhood safety strategy, we took bits and pieces from a variety of different cities and communities, uh, around the country to put together what we thought would work best. And I think we've shown some dramatic success thus far, and we haven't even fully implemented the, the comprehensive neighborhood safety strategy, uh, if you take a look at the reduction in homicides and violent crime. But w- w- we're not satisfied. We wanna be the safest big city in America, and that means, uh, safer for everyone, uh, in the community.

Lauren Sega 19:24Uh, when you announced that you were running for re-election-

Andrew Ginther 19:25Mm

Lauren Sega 19:25... you did so alone.

Andrew Ginther 19:28Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 19:28You're running unchallenged.

Andrew Ginther 19:29Mm-hmm.

Lauren Sega 19:29Why do you think that is?

Andrew Ginther 19:31Well, there are lots of, of, of reasons, uh, to speculate. 20 years ago, there was a Republican mayor, uh, I think at least two members of the Columbus Ci- Republican members of Columbus City Council, and two Republican members of the Board of Education. This year, no Republican candidate for mayor, council, or the Board of Education filed. The Republican Party likes to say it's because of campaign finance and contributions and this and that, whatever. Mind people, because unfortunately, Dispatch decided to regurgitate the GOP's talking points, uh, in their editorial here recently. What I just described to you, a Republican mayor, Republican mayors or council, Republican, uh, school board members, all happened when there weren't campaign contribution limits. So for the first time ever, we put in place campaign contribution limits. Some people argue they're too high, they're too low, whatever it is. First time ever in the city's history, we actually have limits, and more importantly, we have, um, uh, historic exposure of, uh, dark money in local politics. Before, you could spend money on issues and candidates, as I had spent against me, uh, by the Koch brothers' group back in 2015, and nobody knew who their donors were or how they were spending their money. And now, in the city of Columbus, if you wanna influence Columbus voters, you have to disclose where your money's coming from and, and what you're up to. Uh, we think that's, um, significant and important. I would like to think that the people of Columbus, um, believe that we're headed in the right direction, that focusing on affordability, uh, mobility, making sure that we do have the largest middle class of any city our size in the country, and, uh, nation's capital for upward mobility. We wanna be the place where people are more likely to go from poverty to the middle class and beyond than anywhere else. Uh, and by focusing on opportunity neighborhoods and, and shared prosperity, that that resonates with the people of Columbus. Uh, I know we have a long way to go, and the things that I'm working on are not one-year, two-year, four-year initiatives. I mean, you don't bend a 50-year trajectory on infant mortality, uh, in a couple of years. Uh, we are seeing some significant progress, and there's some highlights with sleep-related deaths and other things that we, uh, feel good about and think we're headed in the right direction. Uh, but we know that's gonna take time. You don't turn around, uh, a neighborhood, uh, like Linden when their population has been cut in half-

Lauren Sega 21:54Right

Andrew Ginther 21:54... and the poverty rate has gone through the roof, and, uh, your, your wages are less today than they were, uh, in, in 2000. I mean, that takes time, you know, in the Hilltop and the other neighborhoods. But they know that going from a land bank community to a land trust community is important, to make sure that the 54,000 units that we're short of today, that we wanna work with the county and suburban communities and the private sector to build, we wanna make sure they're there 10 and 20 years from now.

Lauren Sega 22:23Mm-hmm.

Andrew Ginther 22:23Last thing we wanna do is invest all these resources. We've got a historic, um, bond issue that's part of our bond package up, uh, in May, uh, specifically earmarked for neighborhood development and affordable housing, first time ever in the city's history. I think that resonates with the people of Columbus, and they support the, uh, the work we're doing. But nothing drives me crazier than entitlement. Uh, and I say that to my staff, my team, uh, and to myself all the time. Uh, we're not entitled to anything. We have to earn every day. Earn and protect the trust of the public, and fight for our agenda, and that's why we're doing, even though I, there won't be another name on the ballot against me, we've got this, uh, billion-dollar bond package that is absolutely critical to a second term and our agenda for shared prosperity and, uh, our opportunity neighborhoods. That's on the ballot in May. Uh, and we're gonna be, um, doing an unprecedented community organizing effort, uh, to make sure that's successful, and that we have the community organized around mobility, affordabi- uh, affordability, high quality, uh, universal pre-K, all the things that are really important to me, um, uh, in economic development for the future. So, uh, we're gonna be busy this year.

Lauren Sega 23:41Mm-hmm.

Andrew Ginther 23:41And we're gonna be out there talking to people about the things that, that matter to them, uh, their families, and their neighborhoods.

Lauren Sega 23:48So what are your specific goals for your next term in, in building on what you've done thus far?

Andrew Ginther 23:53In your first term It, for me, it really, um, the way I will measure success are more, uh, people in Columbus, uh, sharing our success. Are, are there more families and neighborhoods that have been left out, uh, participating, uh, in our successful trajectory? Are there more affordable homes in neighborhoods where folks have felt the squeeze and felt priced out? And are there market rate homes in neighborhoods where we're putting an unprecedented amount of resources and commitment into recreation centers, into infrastructure, into mobility options and mobility hubs? Are we, uh, ensuring that more young people enter kindergarten ready to learn? And, uh, are we continuing to grow this economy? When I joined council, about 70%, a little less, I think it was actually 68%, of our general revenue fund came from income tax. But based on what's happened at the federal and state level, it is now 80%. So the elimination of the estate tax, the slashing of the local government fund, the phasing out of the personal tangible in favor of the CAT tax, all those things mean that to provide basic city services in neighborhoods throughout the community, people have to be working and they have to be working good paying jobs. That is going to be a top priority for me as well, is continuing to figure out this disconnect. You know, at any given point in this community, uh, you could have 34,000 jobs that are not being filled by people that, uh, live here currently and 32,000 people who have been looking for work for 12 months or longer. And it's not a perfect matchup. Some of those 32,000 are restored citizens. So they have criminal backgrounds and there are barriers that they have to navigate to take advantage of those job opportunities. They might not have the soft skills. They might not have the technical skills, but continuing to try to figure that, um, out. And I think one of the ways that we're going to continue to measure success is there are a lot of cities around the country that have grown dramatically over a short period of time. We're going to, we're going to do that. We're going to grow in the next 20 years. In essence, uh, the amount we did in the last 75, Atlanta, Charlotte, Austin, Seattle, the list goes on and on Denver. How do we grow dramatically, but inclusively? And that's why changing our incentive policy was so important because we believe that mixed income neighborhoods are the most important things. That's what define in large part, what are great cities. And we know that great cities have to have mixed income neighborhoods where working people, seniors and higher wage earners all have a place in that neighborhood. And so, um, that's why the affordable housing by the end of another term, I will measure success. Do we have a regional affordable housing plan that is being executed and being funded by the private sector, the city, the county, the state, our regional partners, uh, to go after that 54,000 unit shortage? Cause that's our shortage today. If we grow by another third over the next 20 years, that number is just going to continue to grow. Uh, and we think this initial $50 million neighborhood development, affordable housing bond issue is that initial down payment. We know that it's going to take a lot more than that from everyone working together on a regional plan because affordable housing isn't just the city's responsibility or the county's. Bexley has a role to play. Grove City has a role to play. Dublin has a role to play. One of the reasons I've been going out and visiting all these suburban mayors and their city halls, uh, not having them come to Columbus city hall is to have them understand that we want a new relationship moving forward. The cities that are thriving nationally and internationally are ones that are acting regionally. And so building that support around major issues, economic development, workforce development, mobility. It's one of the reasons we had over 200 letters of support for our smart cities challenge, uh, application from the likes of Morpsey, all the suburban communities, because they knew that if we became America's first smart city and smart Columbus was successful, the entire region would benefit. Uh, and so that type of cooperation and partnership you're going to continue to see in a second term. Well, thanks so much for your time. You bet. Thanks for having me. Yeah.

Tim Fulton 28:30Thank you for listening to the Confluence Cast presented by Columbus Underground. Again, you can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Please rate, subscribe, share this episode of the Confluence Cast with your friends, family, contacts, enemies, your favorite elected official. If you're interested in sponsoring the Confluence Cast, get in touch with us. We can be reached by email at info at theconfluencecast.com. Our theme music was composed by Benji Robinson. Our producer is Philip Cogley. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. Have a great week.