Volunteering with Besa

Tim Fulton 0:07Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Confluence Cast presented by Columbus Underground. We are a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. This week, I sat down with Matthew Goldstein, executive director of BESA, to talk about helping people and businesses give back to their community, innovative technology-driven approaches to service, the important work being done by nonprofits in Columbus, and the ongoing need for all of us to find ways to give back. You can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Also, the Confluence Cast is on Patreon. Find out how to support this podcast on our website, theconfluencecast.com, or at patreon.com/confluence. The Confluence Cast is sponsored this week by Little Rock Bar. Little Rock Bar is located at 944 North Fourth Street in Italian Village. With 30 beers on tap, Little Rock Bar has happy hour from 4:00 to 8:00 every day. Every Tuesday, get $3 draft beers all night while you enjoy Rock Your Cock Off karaoke. Wednesdays is Everybody's a Comedian, hosted by Travis Haywisher. It's like trivia, but you prove your snark instead of smarts. Info, hours, and upcoming events at littlerockbar.net. Everybody's night should have a little rock. Enjoy the interview. Sitting down here with Matthew Goldstein, the founder and executive director of BESA. Matthew, how are you?

Matthew Goldstein 1:43I'm fantastic. How are you?

Tim Fulton 1:45Good. Thank you so much for sitting down. First of all, give us the lay of the land. What is BESA?

Matthew Goldstein 1:49BESA is a Columbus-based nonprofit. We just celebrated five years.

Tim Fulton 1:53Congratulations.

Matthew Goldstein 1:54Thank you very much.

Tim Fulton 1:55I was at the event.

Matthew Goldstein 1:56Ah, yes, you were.

Tim Fulton 1:57Yes.

Matthew Goldstein 1:57Did you have a good time?

Tim Fulton 1:58I did, and I got a nice lapel pin.

Matthew Goldstein 2:01It's not on you.

Tim Fulton 2:01I didn't. I thought about wearing it. I was in a rush this morning, so.

Matthew Goldstein 2:06Our whole goal is to make it easier for people and businesses to connect with the community.

Tim Fulton 2:10Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 2:10I think a lot of us wanna be engaged with the causes and the interests that impact our community, everything from hunger, homelessness, HIV/AIDS. These are all big problems that Columbus faces.

Tim Fulton 2:24Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 2:24But the challenge is how do you get involved with them? And so BESA makes it easy for people to connect, to learn about these causes, these problems, and then get engaged through volunteer engagement and a whole host of other activities, as well as companies. We work with companies, large companies like Big Lots and, and Safelite, to, you know, smaller organizations like ReWork Furnishings in Grandview-

Tim Fulton 2:45Okay

Matthew Goldstein 2:45... to help them navigate philanthropy and get engaged with the community.

Tim Fulton 2:50So what does that look like? Uh, when you talk about connection, is it simply I go on your website and find volunteer opportunities? Or how, how does that work?

Matthew Goldstein 2:58Yeah. So the way we work is, yes, by all means, anyone from the community can go to our website. At any given time, there's about 30 to 40 high-impact service projects, meaning that last night there were 20 volunteers serving dinner to hundreds of people at the Van Buren Homeless Shelter.

Tim Fulton 3:15Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 3:15Packing up 20,000 diapers for our local food pantries, uh, growing food in Franklinton for that neighborhood.

Tim Fulton 3:22Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 3:22So it's easy within two clicks for you to sign up and give back. We really focus on the experience you're gonna have when you show up, so we have volunteer leaders at every project to help facilitate that interaction and that engagement. Our whole goal is to make sure that you are having a good experience, that you're not just standing around and twiddling your thumbs.

Tim Fulton 3:40Yeah, 'cause I feel like sometimes you would go... People would say, like, "Oh, I wanna go, like, volunteer at a festival," and you show up right at the beginning, and there's nobody there-

Matthew Goldstein 3:49Yeah

Tim Fulton 3:49... to, like, tell you what to do.

Matthew Goldstein 3:51So-

Tim Fulton 3:51There's somebody there to give you your T-shirt.

Matthew Goldstein 3:53Yeah.

Tim Fulton 3:53But yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 3:53So our goal is n- to make sure that it's not just this transactional experience, but it's transformative.

Tim Fulton 3:58Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 3:58And the way we go about doing that is making sure we understand what our people want, right, our volunteers-

Tim Fulton 4:05Okay

Matthew Goldstein 4:05... in terms of an experience, making sure that we identify the needs of the companies we work with so that they are best suited to use their resources to have the greatest impact in the community. But then even more than all of that is working with our nonprofit partners to understand what their needs are, where are their gaps, and how can BESA help fill those gaps-

Tim Fulton 4:24Okay

Matthew Goldstein 4:24... so that they can do more good with their resources and, and our resources.

Tim Fulton 4:28With the limited resources they have.

Matthew Goldstein 4:29With limited resources.

Tim Fulton 4:30Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 4:30So for example, Dress for Success.

Tim Fulton 4:33Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 4:33It's located in the Short North at Fifth and High. They are celebrating 10 years of working with thousands of women-

Tim Fulton 4:39Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 4:40... helping them gain access to employment. And we have partnered with Dress for Success now for-

Tim Fulton 4:45And let's talk about that a little bit. They do that through their name. You know-

Matthew Goldstein 4:49Yeah

Tim Fulton 4:49... they provide clothing for women to wear on job interviews. They do some job training, interview training specifically, right?

Matthew Goldstein 4:57They do. Yeah.

Tim Fulton 4:58Okay. And so then where does, where does BESA come in?

Matthew Goldstein 5:01Yeah. Well, first of all, Dress is this incredible asset to Columbus. Like every nonprofit-

Tim Fulton 5:07Is it a local organization?

Matthew Goldstein 5:08It's international with local chapters.

Tim Fulton 5:10Got it.

Matthew Goldstein 5:11So Columbus has a local chapter.

Tim Fulton 5:12Got it, okay.

Matthew Goldstein 5:13One of the biggest challenges a nonprofit faces is their mission is overwhelming, and they have limited resources, like you said earlier, right? And so it's easy to start looking at your clients as numbers and just trying to get them through the door and making sure they meet re- certain requirements. If they don't, then, you know, they can't get access to your resources, and you just keep moving on and on, right?

Tim Fulton 5:35Right.

Matthew Goldstein 5:35Dress treats-

Tim Fulton 5:36Well, and that's... And let's talk about why that happens, right? That is because of, as a nonprofit, you're accountable to your board, one.

Matthew Goldstein 5:43Yep.

Tim Fulton 5:44Your board wants to hear how are you successful year over year. I imagine with Dress for Success, that metric is simply how many people, how many women did you place into jobs and how... You know, what was the cost per at that point.

Matthew Goldstein 5:57Yeah.

Tim Fulton 5:57And then also you've got to apply for grants, right?

Matthew Goldstein 5:59Definitely.

Tim Fulton 6:00And all grants can sort of evaluate on is not, like, how nice does your logo look or did you write a really compelling statement. That is part of it, but it's a lot, again, about those metrics.

Matthew Goldstein 6:11Yeah. I mean, every year y- you start over, right?

Tim Fulton 6:14Right.

Matthew Goldstein 6:14Like, so if you have a budget of, let's say, half a million dollars- You're spending that half a million dollars, and then next year you have to raise that money again-

Tim Fulton 6:22Right

Matthew Goldstein 6:22... to your point, through grants and, and, and individual donors and everything else. And so it's easy to focus on the money you have to raise and lose sight sometimes of the, you know, the impact that you're trying to create in the community.

Tim Fulton 6:35Right.

Matthew Goldstein 6:35Dress is one of those organizations that does a really good job of staying focused on their clients and treating every single woman that comes through that door as a human being, and share love and kindness with them. There's a story of, so a woman came through and she needed a job, and she came through for interview-

Tim Fulton 6:54Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 6:55... assistance, as well as some clothes for her job interview.

Tim Fulton 6:59Right.

Matthew Goldstein 6:59And this guy Ralph helped her. She left, she came back the next day, and she had these trash bags in her hand. And she said, "Hi, I'm here to see Ralph. I need to talk to Ralph." And they're like, "Well, he's not here today."

Tim Fulton 7:11Right.

Matthew Goldstein 7:11They ended up getting Vicky, their CEO. Vicky came from the back, saw this woman with these two big trash can- trash bags, and was like, "What is going on here? What did we do wrong?"

Tim Fulton 7:19Right.

Matthew Goldstein 7:19And she's like, "Listen, yesterday Ralph helped me, and he made me feel so good. I took all the clothes I had in my closet, put them in these bags, and I want him to show me how to dress myself every single day."

Tim Fulton 7:31Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 7:31And that's one story of thousands where Dress is empowering women to be the best version of themselves, to get-

Tim Fulton 7:38Yeah

Matthew Goldstein 7:38... to their next. And so for us, for BESA, to partner with organizations that are really uplifting the community-

Tim Fulton 7:44Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 7:44... that's what we do best. So for, in, in the example of Dress, they're only-

Tim Fulton 7:48Yeah, how do you guys partner with them?

Matthew Goldstein 7:50Yeah. A few ways. The biggest way, I would say, is they're only open Monday through Friday.

Tim Fulton 7:54Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 7:54Typically Monday through Friday, and I think part of that might be the resources that they have, right?

Tim Fulton 7:59Right.

Matthew Goldstein 7:59And so we partner with them. They're now open an additional Saturday every month.

Tim Fulton 8:03Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 8:03And through BESA, we provide volunteers, we provide a volunteer leader. There's no one there from Dress when we're there, so they're able to help more women without increasing their overhead.

Tim Fulton 8:13Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 8:13And so they've been able to help 300 more women gain access to employment through this partnership with BESA.

Tim Fulton 8:18Wow. Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 8:20And then we look for other ways to engage the community with Dress. So this year we spearheaded a campaign to transform their fitting rooms.

Tim Fulton 8:29Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 8:29So you think about somebody who hasn't had, uh, an opportunity, or let's say someone that, that was in prison-

Tim Fulton 8:35Okay

Matthew Goldstein 8:35... and is looking for a new job, and has a lot of stress going on, and hasn't been in workplace attire in a long time, if ever.

Tim Fulton 8:42If ever, right.

Matthew Goldstein 8:43And so the first time that they come out of a fitting room, you want them to feel empowered and on top of their game so they can go into that interview and just kill it, right?

Tim Fulton 8:52Right.

Matthew Goldstein 8:52We asked Vicky, the CEO of Dress, "You know, if there's something you could change about Dress for Success, what would it be?" And she said, "You know what? From day one, the fitting rooms. In 10 years, I would love to update these fitting rooms."

Tim Fulton 9:03'Cause they just look like normal department store-

Matthew Goldstein 9:06I mean, it's your definition-

Tim Fulton 9:07Or are they just-

Matthew Goldstein 9:07... of normal. Like, I, I-

Tim Fulton 9:08Are they bathrooms? What

Matthew Goldstein 9:08... maybe if, if you go into, like, maybe a TJ Maxx where it's, like, the shower curtain with the-

Tim Fulton 9:13Oh, wow. Okay

Matthew Goldstein 9:14... uh, it, it wasn't... And, and Vicky, if you're listening, please forgive me. But, but they weren't an uplifting story of the Dress experience, right?

Tim Fulton 9:22Right.

Matthew Goldstein 9:22So the second you walk into the Dress stores, you're greeted by a woman. They give you, you know, a, a, an employee, they give you a bottle of water. They really treat you like family.

Tim Fulton 9:30Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 9:30You go through this whole process, then you get to the fitting rooms, and the, and the colors are harsh, the lighting is harsh, everything is harsh, and it's not set up for you to look in the mirror and see yourself at the top of your game.

Tim Fulton 9:41Right.

Matthew Goldstein 9:41And so we spearheaded this campaign based on what they told us to redo the whole fitting room-

Tim Fulton 9:45Okay

Matthew Goldstein 9:46... experience. And so we brought in seven partners, from Homage to Express to the Columbus Foundation to an architect firm and a design firm, to redo it. It was a $70,000 renovation.

Tim Fulton 9:58Wow.

Matthew Goldstein 9:58And now it's like walking out of a Nordstrom fitting room.

Tim Fulton 10:01Right.

Matthew Goldstein 10:01There's chandeliers. The lighting is better. The color palette is warmer.

Tim Fulton 10:06Right.

Matthew Goldstein 10:06This is something Vicky told us. These women look at these magazines, right? What's a woman's magazine?

Tim Fulton 10:11Elle.

Matthew Goldstein 10:12Elle. Perfect, right? And they see these women, and they're like, "That's not me."

Tim Fulton 10:17Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 10:17And, and now they feel more in line with what they're seeing in the magazine, that, that they can be just like those women in terms of how they look and how they feel.

Tim Fulton 10:26Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 10:27And that's what it's all about: transforming lives.

Tim Fulton 10:29That's great. Let's talk about the nonprofit landscape in Columbus a little bit.

Matthew Goldstein 10:33Sure.

Tim Fulton 10:33Like, Dress for Success, I would cons- not knowing them and not being super familiar with the organization-

Matthew Goldstein 10:38Yeah

Tim Fulton 10:38... I would say it's sort of a medium level in terms of, like, budget, how much, how much they serve. You know?

Matthew Goldstein 10:44Yeah.

Tim Fulton 10:44They're certainly not like a United Way. They are well-liked, well-respected. I- that's a testament to Vicky's work and also a testament to-

Matthew Goldstein 10:50Definitely

Tim Fulton 10:51... their location and how long they've had a large impact in Columbus. What are the other nonprofits that you're sort of working-

Matthew Goldstein 10:58Yeah

Tim Fulton 10:58... with actively?

Matthew Goldstein 10:59So there's about 2,500 nonprofits in our community.

Tim Fulton 11:02In Columbus? Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 11:03Yeah, yeah. Uh, Columbus, Central Ohio. Um, and the vast majority of them work with a limited budget under of a quarter million dollars.

Tim Fulton 11:11Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 11:11So you think about when you hire a staff person, executive director, and maybe somebody else, that takes a lot of resources right there, and doesn't-

Tim Fulton 11:17That's almost 250 right there, right?

Matthew Goldstein 11:19Yeah. So a lot of them are doing a lot of good with limited staff.

Tim Fulton 11:23Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 11:23I would agree with you that Dress is one of those ones that's a little bigger.

Tim Fulton 11:27Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 11:27Obviously, there's much larger ones: Ohio State University, the zoo.

Tim Fulton 11:30Right.

Matthew Goldstein 11:30United Way.

Tim Fulton 11:31Now, but do you guys partner with those types of org-

Matthew Goldstein 11:35Yeah

Tim Fulton 11:35... the zoo-

Matthew Goldstein 11:35Yeah

Tim Fulton 11:35... for example.

Matthew Goldstein 11:36We haven't partnered with the zoo.

Tim Fulton 11:38Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 11:38Uh, we do partner with smaller nonprofits. Broad Street Food Pantry-

Tim Fulton 11:42Okay

Matthew Goldstein 11:42... which is in the downtown area. We partner with them every single month. We've done a lot of good work with them. We've even done supply drives to help get them the supplies they need.

Tim Fulton 11:51Okay. I'm trying to sort of, like, wrap the audience's head around what exactly it is you guys do. Is it fair to say that you augment/replace what a traditional volunteer coordinator would do?

Matthew Goldstein 12:04I wouldn't say we replace.

Tim Fulton 12:06Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 12:07But we s- we definitely support, and it really depends on the relationship. So to answer your question-

Tim Fulton 12:12Yeah

Matthew Goldstein 12:13... smaller organizations that don't have the resources, yes, we can step in and provide... Even a lot of our nonprofit partners trust us to provide the orientation ... for our volunteers about the nonprofit's mission.

Tim Fulton 12:26Which would be a volunteer coordinator job.

Matthew Goldstein 12:29Yeah.

Tim Fulton 12:29Right.

Matthew Goldstein 12:29Yeah. And, and that's a huge thing, right?

Tim Fulton 12:32Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 12:32These are nonprofits trusting us with their messaging. And so, yes, we can step in, and we also work with larger nonprofits, Ronald McDonald House, Mid-Ohio Food Bank. We have a group going there today.

Tim Fulton 12:44Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 12:44They have a great volunteer program, and it's easy for our volunteers to plug in. And what we do in those cases is sometimes work with their team to identify unique opportunities. So again, it doesn't just feel like tr- it's a transactional experience.

Tim Fulton 12:59Right.

Matthew Goldstein 12:59So for example, Nina West-

Tim Fulton 13:01Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 13:02... and her crew for the, uh, holiday show-

Tim Fulton 13:05Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 13:05... Wheels of Horror, Horror 10.

Tim Fulton 13:07Right.

Matthew Goldstein 13:07Yep. They love giving back to the community, and so we plugged them in with Ronald McDonald House.

Tim Fulton 13:12Uh-huh.

Matthew Goldstein 13:13And they did a trick-or-treat Halloween experience with families there. And we work directly with the team at Ronald to come up with the activities because w- we understand what Nina and the crew want. We understand the framework that Ronald has in place.

Tim Fulton 13:26Right.

Matthew Goldstein 13:27So we're able to make sure it's not extra work on the nonprofit's side, and we're also able to make sure that Nina and the crew gets the most fulfilling experience so that they wanna come back-

Tim Fulton 13:36Right

Matthew Goldstein 13:36... year after year.

Tim Fulton 13:37Well, and I think that's part of the reason why it's sort of difficult to explain what BESA does, is that it's, it really depends on the client, right? It depends on either the individual or the corporation that's trying to contribute.

Matthew Goldstein 13:48Yeah.

Tim Fulton 13:48And it depends on the nonprofit and what their needs are. You're, you're making those connections.

Matthew Goldstein 13:52Our... Yeah, to simplify it, that's exactly what it is. We, we believe we're connectors. We connect people and businesses to the community.

Tim Fulton 14:00Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 14:00And by community, I mean to nonprofits, and we work with all our stakeholders to really bridge those opportunities so people can have the biggest impact in personal and significant ways that, that are personal and significant to them.

Tim Fulton 14:14And I know you're a nonprofit. Talk to me about-

Matthew Goldstein 14:16Yeah

Tim Fulton 14:16... though, like, you know, how do you guys keep your lights on?

Matthew Goldstein 14:19Yeah.

Tim Fulton 14:19Is it, is it from the companies-

Matthew Goldstein 14:21Yeah

Tim Fulton 14:22... that you're helping coordinate their philanthropy or-

Matthew Goldstein 14:24Yeah. So our logo is a tree, and we actually have that tree in our backyard.

Tim Fulton 14:28Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 14:28And it, and the leaves are dollar bills, and

Tim Fulton 14:31Ah, money grows on trees for you.

Matthew Goldstein 14:32Yeah.

Tim Fulton 14:33Good.

Matthew Goldstein 14:33Yeah, no. Since we started... So, so, uh, nonprofits are businesses. They're not-for-profit businesses.

Tim Fulton 14:41Right.

Matthew Goldstein 14:41IRS classifies them as businesses, and I think sometimes that gets lost in that idea of, of... I used to think that, you know, you just get individual donations, and you have to really work the street and, and get those donations.

Tim Fulton 14:54Right.

Matthew Goldstein 14:54And that's definitely true, but especially after the-

Tim Fulton 14:57Well, that's a model, right?

Matthew Goldstein 14:58That is a model. Especially after the recession, that model is really difficult to sustain.

Tim Fulton 15:03Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 15:03And since BESA started, our team, our board, has always said that we need to be diversified in our income. So that means individual donors who-

Tim Fulton 15:11Okay

Matthew Goldstein 15:11... are incredibly important to our mission, are some of our biggest advocates. That means grants, but that also means social enterprises, earned revenue.

Tim Fulton 15:19Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 15:19So we work with businesses, again, to engage their employees, a company like Jenny's, who has 700, 800 employees. We help facilitate volunteer programming for their employees, and then Jenny's pays us to provide that service.

Tim Fulton 15:33Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 15:34And so another one is we have software that we sell to companies so that they can better manage their philanthropy program.

Tim Fulton 15:42Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 15:43There are large companies in town that were, they were using Microsoft Excel to manage their philanthropy program.

Tim Fulton 15:49Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 15:49You can do that, but then it's not an effective use of your resources.

Tim Fulton 15:53Right.

Matthew Goldstein 15:54Right? So we have software that allows you to get out of the weeds, the administrative day-to-day activities, and focus on the big picture of driving your philanthropy program.

Tim Fulton 16:02So that you're tracking both dollars given-

Matthew Goldstein 16:05You got it

Tim Fulton 16:06... hours volunteered-

Matthew Goldstein 16:08Yep

Tim Fulton 16:08... quantifying the worth of those hours.

Matthew Goldstein 16:10Yep.

Tim Fulton 16:11Because frankly, for those private corporations, that's a tax write-off.

Matthew Goldstein 16:15It is.

Tim Fulton 16:15I mean, that's what you're-

Matthew Goldstein 16:16Yeah

Tim Fulton 16:16... facilitating, is sort of this, you know... The reason why you track that stuff is so that at the end of the year, y- you can say, "And here's what we gave."

Matthew Goldstein 16:25That also-

Tim Fulton 16:25And you can also say that in a campaign, too.

Matthew Goldstein 16:27Yeah, and, and one of the biggest challenges a, a, a company has is a lot of companies in Columbus-

Tim Fulton 16:33Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 16:34... are very giving, but they don't have all the data points lined up to be able to tell their story and understand their impact.

Tim Fulton 16:43Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 16:43And so we help them facilitate and really understand what is the true impact they're having in the community and how to tell that story, not only to the outward community, but to their inner community, their employees-

Tim Fulton 16:55Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 16:55... so that they can encourage their employees to be even more engaged in the community. 'Cause a lot of employees, particularly millennials today, one of the questions they always ask on job interviews is, "What is the company doing in the community? How is the company supporting the community?"

Tim Fulton 17:10Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 17:10People wanna work for companies that are engaged in the community.

Tim Fulton 17:13Right.

Matthew Goldstein 17:13And so we're able to help companies answer that question.

Tim Fulton 17:16Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 17:17So that software is called BESA Promise. That launched last year. That was our second social enterprise, and 65% of our revenue comes from social enterprises revenue.

Tim Fulton 17:27Okay. And so is that, is it a piece of software they buy?

Matthew Goldstein 17:31Mm-hmm.

Tim Fulton 17:31Is it software as a service?

Matthew Goldstein 17:32You got it. So it's software as a service.

Tim Fulton 17:34Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 17:34It's a license. They pay us an annual license.

Tim Fulton 17:37The web portal.

Matthew Goldstein 17:38Web portal, you got it. And, you know, the way it works in the grand scheme of things is our whole mission is to connect more people to community service to make giving back a bigger part of everyday life. And so we see the software as a way to engage now, let's say, a company like Big Lots with thousands of employees-

Tim Fulton 17:55Right

Matthew Goldstein 17:55... to help engage and facilitate their journey into that world of community engagement and, and giving back.

Tim Fulton 18:03And does it do planning, or is it more just, like, reporting out?

Matthew Goldstein 18:06It plans and reports, yes.

Tim Fulton 18:08I mean, does it have, like, a CRM aspect where it's like, "Hey, this person gave this many hours," and, like, we know that-

Matthew Goldstein 18:14Yep

Tim Fulton 18:15... and it can then... Wow.

Matthew Goldstein 18:16Yeah.

Tim Fulton 18:16Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 18:16Yeah. So it's, the, it, it-

Tim Fulton 18:17What's it co- Is it a different cost per how you're using it or?

Matthew Goldstein 18:21Yeah. So it's based on the number of employees you have, the specific s- services you want from it.

Tim Fulton 18:27Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 18:27So-

Tim Fulton 18:28So let's say I have a, a company, medium-sized company.

Matthew Goldstein 18:31Yeah.

Tim Fulton 18:31I can't go on and sign up for it. I really have to engage with, like, sales in order to, like, figure out-

Matthew Goldstein 18:35Correct.

Tim Fulton 18:36Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 18:36Yeah, and that's one of our biggest challenges right now. We built this. This is something we're working through right now.

Tim Fulton 18:40Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 18:41We saw an opportunity to build this software. We saw that it would be an asset to the community.

Tim Fulton 18:46Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 18:47We built it, again, a year and a half ago. We signed on some great clients, Big Lots, Safelite, Columbia Gas of Ohio-

Tim Fulton 18:54Wow

Matthew Goldstein 18:54... MySource, GBQ. But it's a product that's essentially sitting on the shelf. We don't go out and knock on companies' doors and say, "Hey, we have this great product." It's when Big Lots is using it, and then they tell the philanthropy person at another company, "Oh my God, you need to bring BESA into your office for a conversation. They have this great product."

Tim Fulton 19:13Right.

Matthew Goldstein 19:13So right now it's essentially sitting on the shelf, and we are trying to figure out how to really market this product so that it can-

Tim Fulton 19:19You gotta hire a sales guy. I mean-

Matthew Goldstein 19:21Yeah

Tim Fulton 19:22... yeah. But-

Matthew Goldstein 19:22But, but even before a salesperson, someone to create the marketing program for it-

Tim Fulton 19:26Right

Matthew Goldstein 19:26... so that not only can we gain more clients, but the bigger goal is to do more good in the community.

Tim Fulton 19:33Yeah. That's exciting, though.

Matthew Goldstein 19:34Yeah, it's very exciting.

Tim Fulton 19:36I mean, it's, it's exciting to not just sort of, like, have an idea and sort, and, and be at the point now where it's like, "What am I gonna do with all this asset?"

Matthew Goldstein 19:44Yeah.

Tim Fulton 19:44You know?

Matthew Goldstein 19:45Yeah.

Tim Fulton 19:45That's a good spot to be in.

Matthew Goldstein 19:47It's also exciting because we see it as a vehicle to take BESA on the road, to take, grow BESA outside of Columbus.

Tim Fulton 19:52Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 19:53We have a lot of partners that are in a lot of communities, and they want BESA to be there with them, and so this technology will help us grow outside of Columbus.

Tim Fulton 20:02And is it the technology that you use to manage your, like, volunteer leaders-

Matthew Goldstein 20:07Yeah

Tim Fulton 20:07... and stuff?

Matthew Goldstein 20:07It's... That's an interesting question. We basically have two separate technology solutions. There's BESA-

Tim Fulton 20:13Okay

Matthew Goldstein 20:13... which, you know, everyone uses and knows, right? And then there's BESA Promise's corporate philanthropy software.

Tim Fulton 20:19Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 20:19And so one of our next big goals is merging the two together so it can be more productive, and then really building out the services-

Tim Fulton 20:26Right

Matthew Goldstein 20:26... and the software so that we can grow the impact and, and start moving into other communities.

Tim Fulton 20:30Well, and it sounds to me that, like, it's going to end up being sort of a, you're familiar with, like, Salesforce or HubSpot-

Matthew Goldstein 20:35Yeah

Tim Fulton 20:35... where there's, like, Salesforce and HubSpot marketing.

Matthew Goldstein 20:38Yeah.

Tim Fulton 20:38And then there's the sales.

Matthew Goldstein 20:40Yeah.

Tim Fulton 20:40And yeah-

Matthew Goldstein 20:40Yeah

Tim Fulton 20:40... they talk to each other.

Matthew Goldstein 20:41Yeah.

Tim Fulton 20:42They're, they're, quote-unquote, integrated, but really they are sort of these separate basically silos that talk to each other.

Matthew Goldstein 20:47Yeah.

Tim Fulton 20:48And that's, I think sometimes you almost kind of don't want to supplant yourself and make it so that the corporation can manage their, you know, their volunteer engagement all on their own. You kinda wanna be part of that.

Matthew Goldstein 20:59Well, yeah.

Tim Fulton 20:59And so you keep those silos separate. You know what I mean?

Matthew Goldstein 21:02We definitely want... You know, we imagine an ecosystem. Right now, the way BESA is set up is it's really the power is with me and my team-

Tim Fulton 21:12Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 21:12... in terms of setting up the projects, posting the projects, recruiting volunteers, the volunteer leader, and we really want the power to be with the community, a much more community-centric model-

Tim Fulton 21:21Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 21:21... so that nonprofits are able to post projects. The challenge there-

Tim Fulton 21:25Can they post projects on their own?

Matthew Goldstein 21:26Not right now.

Tim Fulton 21:27Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 21:27No.

Tim Fulton 21:28Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 21:28And the challenge, the, the reason why is everything we do is a curated experience, and we wanna make sure you, as a volunteer, have the best opportunity to engage the community. So that's why we're controlling that entire experience as much as possible.

Tim Fulton 21:41That ecosystem. Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 21:42That ecosystem. But that, the challenge there is it's hard to grow because it's really resource intensive.

Tim Fulton 21:48Right.

Matthew Goldstein 21:48But, you know, imagine... And so if we open it up to nonprofits, and there are other volunteer platforms out there where nonprofits can post projects-

Tim Fulton 21:55Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 21:56... the challenge is you have no idea what you're getting yourself into.

Tim Fulton 21:58Right.

Matthew Goldstein 21:59And so we wanna create an ecosystem and environment where you have the most relevant information in front of you to make the best decision for yourself-

Tim Fulton 22:07Right

Matthew Goldstein 22:07... to engage in the community. So for example, you know, you think about businesses like Amazon-

Tim Fulton 22:12Uh-huh

Matthew Goldstein 22:13... or Netflix. They have, what, 10,000-plus titles.

Tim Fulton 22:16Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 22:17But you sign on, and it's curated just for you. They understand what you wanna see, what's most relevant to you. It's based on what you've done before. It's based on ratings and reviews. But-

Tim Fulton 22:26So you flag, like, this person tends to like to get dirty-

Matthew Goldstein 22:30Yeah, yeah

Tim Fulton 22:30... or this person likes to do physical labor, or-

Matthew Goldstein 22:31We're not there yet. That's where we're going

Tim Fulton 22:33... this people likes-

Matthew Goldstein 22:33Yeah

Tim Fulton 22:34... this people likes to interact with others.

Matthew Goldstein 22:36That's where we're going. That's where we're heading. So when a nonprofit posts a project based on, let's say, the reviews that the community has, let's say Ronald McDonald House-

Tim Fulton 22:45Right

Matthew Goldstein 22:46... has access to this theoretical system. They can po- post a project, and they have five out of five stars and, you know, all this great feedback.

Tim Fulton 22:52And they can add these tags that are like-

Matthew Goldstein 22:54Yep

Tim Fulton 22:54... "Hey, you work with kids."

Matthew Goldstein 22:55Yep.

Tim Fulton 22:55"Hey, we work with families. Hey, we don't"-

Matthew Goldstein 22:57So it's not just like-

Tim Fulton 22:58"... uh, build houses"

Matthew Goldstein 22:58... every project thrown at the wall, and you see-

Tim Fulton 23:00Right

Matthew Goldstein 23:00... everything, and it's overwhelming.

Tim Fulton 23:02Right.

Matthew Goldstein 23:03Right? It's relevant to you as an individual.

Tim Fulton 23:06How many people on staff do you have?

Matthew Goldstein 23:08We have four right now. We're working to get to, uh, add two more.

Tim Fulton 23:11Okay. And what's your annual budget?

Matthew Goldstein 23:13Our annual budget is, this year, will be right around 400,000.

Tim Fulton 23:17That's great. That's a- I mean, five years, that's awesome.

Matthew Goldstein 23:20Yeah. I, we've doubled every year, which is fantastic.

Tim Fulton 23:24Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 23:24It's easy to double when you're small, right?

Tim Fulton 23:26Right.

Matthew Goldstein 23:27But we see so much opportunity, so we actually just launched a million-dollar campaign to get to our next-

Tim Fulton 23:33Oh, wow.

Matthew Goldstein 23:33Yeah. And so that's what we're working on now.

Tim Fulton 23:34And so is that a giving campaign that, like, you're soliciting from corporations and your previous partners?

Matthew Goldstein 23:39Yeah. So we have great partners that have been a part of, of BESA since the beginning-

Tim Fulton 23:44Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 23:44... some that have, you know, come on in the past couple of years and, and have really been a, a part of this journey.

Tim Fulton 23:48Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 23:49And so those are the ones that we're asking, you know, to come down this next path with us-

Tim Fulton 23:54Right

Matthew Goldstein 23:54... help us get there.

Tim Fulton 23:55Great.

Matthew Goldstein 23:55Yeah.

Tim Fulton 23:55And it's basically a capital campaign for you guys.

Matthew Goldstein 23:57It is. It's a capital campaign.

Tim Fulton 23:58Great.

Matthew Goldstein 23:58Yeah.

Tim Fulton 23:59That's awesome. How did this start?

Matthew Goldstein 24:01How did this start?

Tim Fulton 24:01What is your background?

Matthew Goldstein 24:03My background.

Tim Fulton 24:04I don't think I know this, actually. Full disclosure, you and I, well, uh, for another month, sit on the Create Columbus Commission together. You're stepping off because you're a very busy man. But where did you... What is your background?

Matthew Goldstein 24:17My background. I'm from Philadelphia.

Tim Fulton 24:19Uh-huh.

Matthew Goldstein 24:20Have you been?

Tim Fulton 24:20Yes. Center City mostly.

Matthew Goldstein 24:22Yep.

Tim Fulton 24:22Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 24:23So I grew up in Philadelphia. I came to Ohio State University-

Tim Fulton 24:26Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 24:26... the Ohio State University, uh, 1999.

Tim Fulton 24:29Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 24:29Graduated with degrees in marketing and political science, went right into the business world. My father worked-

Tim Fulton 24:34Worked for...?

Matthew Goldstein 24:35Well, real quick, uh, my entire family has been in business, have owned their own businesses, and so-

Tim Fulton 24:39Oh, okay

Matthew Goldstein 24:40... like, it was just, like, in my- Like psyche, right? Like-

Tim Fulton 24:43This is what you do

Matthew Goldstein 24:44... this is what I'm going to do.

Tim Fulton 24:44Right.

Matthew Goldstein 24:45And so I first worked for a retail consulting firm in town, and worked with companies like Walmart to really help them understand consumer trends.

Tim Fulton 24:53Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 24:54And then I almost went to Target out in Minne- Minneapolis.

Tim Fulton 24:57Minneapolis.

Matthew Goldstein 24:58Thank you.

Tim Fulton 24:59Yes.

Matthew Goldstein 24:59Twice actually, but stayed here, and was recruited by Abercrombie, and did market research for them for about five years.

Tim Fulton 25:05Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 25:06Both were great opportunities, right? So you think about Abercrombie-

Tim Fulton 25:09Learned a lot.

Matthew Goldstein 25:09Learned a lot

Tim Fulton 25:09... learned how to work within a corporate structure.

Matthew Goldstein 25:11You got it.

Tim Fulton 25:12Right.

Matthew Goldstein 25:12It's good stuff, but it wasn't the right fit for me. There was something inside of me that wasn't being fulfilled.

Tim Fulton 25:18Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 25:18And I didn't know what that was, and so when I was 27, I was at Abercrombie and I said to myself, "I don't know where I'm supposed to be, but by the time I'm 30, I wanna have that figured out."

Tim Fulton 25:30Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 25:30I know it's not supposed to be here, so by the time I'm 30, you know, I should be somewhere else. And I started working on that plan.

Tim Fulton 25:36Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 25:36And I did all kinds of different things, and one of them was volunteer on a crisis hotline, a suicide hotline-

Tim Fulton 25:42Okay

Matthew Goldstein 25:42... on Saturday mornings, and it was a three-hour shift. It was one of the most fulfilling opportunities of my entire life and of my weeks when I was doing it.

Tim Fulton 25:52Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 25:52And I wanted more of that. So I started volunteering more, and then I got my coworkers involved, and that's when this light bulb went off that I work with smart and talented people-

Tim Fulton 26:00Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 26:00... that wanna give back. They're not sure how to give back, and that's the idea of BESA.

Tim Fulton 26:04Okay. And so what are you doing? I don't know that I would know about BESA if I didn't know you. How are you... I mean, it's a testament given the, the turnout that you had for your five-year anniversary event, gala, party, celebration.

Matthew Goldstein 26:18Celebration, sure.

Tim Fulton 26:19But what, what are you guys doing-

Matthew Goldstein 26:22Yeah

Tim Fulton 26:22... in terms of getting the word out about BESA?

Matthew Goldstein 26:24Yeah. A lot of it is social media.

Tim Fulton 26:27Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 26:28So for example, I volunteered at the homeless shelter a couple months ago, and there were these three, uh, younger, uh, women there, and it turns out that one of them volunteered the, the month before.

Tim Fulton 26:40Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 26:40She posted a photo that we posted. She re-shared it, and her two friends saw it and said, "We wanna do that." And she's like, "Well, I'll go with you next month." So one person came the previous month, and then the next month brought two of her friends. So right there, you know, you have three people. That idea of the viral aspect of it-

Tim Fulton 26:56Right

Matthew Goldstein 26:56... is what works for us. Just people sharing.

Tim Fulton 26:58Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 26:58Word of mouth.

Tim Fulton 26:59Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 26:59That's what I'm looking for.

Tim Fulton 27:00Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 27:00And then, yeah, we, we... The news has been v- really good to us in terms-

Tim Fulton 27:04Okay

Matthew Goldstein 27:04... of sharing our stories, but I would say the biggest thing is social media, because that's where our audience is. And then nonprofits. We work with a lot of good nonprofits, about 70 right now.

Tim Fulton 27:14Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 27:14And so they share the story of what they're doing with us with the greater nonprofit community, and that just opens more doors for us.

Tim Fulton 27:22Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 27:23I think the way we lead in terms of, of getting the word out is being authentic to ourselves and allowing our story to be shared by our partners.

Tim Fulton 27:31Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 27:32And that's where we've h- we've had the most success and we've h- where we've had the best partnerships, be it with volunteers, companies, or nonprofits.

Tim Fulton 27:39Well, it's interesting, right? Because you sort of... Your goal is to facilitate these things. You just, you kinda don't wanna be... You want to trumpet the good wor- the good volunteering work that people are doing. That's why BESA Promise exists. You want to facilitate and get people involved with other nonprofits, but at the same time, you have a responsibility to your organization to sort of trumpet yourself because it's the only way that those-

Matthew Goldstein 28:06Yeah

Tim Fulton 28:06... other two things are gonna happen. You know what I mean?

Matthew Goldstein 28:08It's true. I mean, even in terms of-

Tim Fulton 28:09It's weird-

Matthew Goldstein 28:10It is

Tim Fulton 28:11... though.

Matthew Goldstein 28:11Even in how we try to raise funds, right?

Tim Fulton 28:14Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 28:15So sometimes it's hard for us to tell our story of why you should invest your dollars in BESA, because it's not like, "Give us money. We're solving homelessness," right? Homelessness is-

Tim Fulton 28:25No, you're facilitating the, that these other organizations.

Matthew Goldstein 28:28Exactly.

Tim Fulton 28:28And you're not a grant-making organization.

Matthew Goldstein 28:30No.

Tim Fulton 28:31You're not giving money-

Matthew Goldstein 28:31Yeah

Tim Fulton 28:32... to... You're facilitating volunteer hours.

Matthew Goldstein 28:35Yeah, yeah. So telling that side of it and, and compelling people or to, to get them excited about being a partner of BESA-

Tim Fulton 28:43Mm-hmm

Matthew Goldstein 28:43... you know, there's an extra step there because it's not as easy as just saying, "We're a homeless shelter or a food pantry" if-

Tim Fulton 28:49Right. I'm actually curious at this point, did you decide to become a nonprofit, or was that sort of like, "Well, we sort of have to be"?

Matthew Goldstein 28:57Yeah.

Tim Fulton 28:58I'm thinking about, like, Blackbaud and Kantara that o-

Matthew Goldstein 29:00Mm-hmm, yeah

Tim Fulton 29:00... that are, like, giving and, like-

Matthew Goldstein 29:02For-profit

Tim Fulton 29:02... uh, for-profit-

Matthew Goldstein 29:04Yeah

Tim Fulton 29:04... software organizations-

Matthew Goldstein 29:05You got it

Tim Fulton 29:05... that facilitate giving and, and volunteer management to an extent, but they are huge and they're difficult-

Matthew Goldstein 29:12Yeah

Tim Fulton 29:12... to work with. I imagine everyone that's listening doesn't know what that is unless you've worked for a large nonprofit.

Matthew Goldstein 29:18Yeah.

Tim Fulton 29:18What d-

Matthew Goldstein 29:19Or a large company-

Tim Fulton 29:19Right

Matthew Goldstein 29:19... 'cause they have software for corporations.

Tim Fulton 29:22Right.

Matthew Goldstein 29:23When we launched, before we launched, we always knew we wanted to be a nonprofit-

Tim Fulton 29:27Okay

Matthew Goldstein 29:27... because of our mission to really, eh, make it easier and to connect people to their community.

Tim Fulton 29:33Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 29:33Right? That just feels like something that is about the community. The word community is in it.

Tim Fulton 29:37Right.

Matthew Goldstein 29:38And so, and even the way we wanted to structure our funding, we wanted to be able to be, say that we are supported by the community.

Tim Fulton 29:45Right.

Matthew Goldstein 29:46When we launched our software, we did talk about making that as a s- a spinoff, right?

Tim Fulton 29:50Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 29:50A for-profit, and we could do that, but what we realized is all of a sudden, then you have two separate companies, two separate boards, two separate staff. It becomes much more complicated.

Tim Fulton 30:00Right.

Matthew Goldstein 30:00And so we wanted to keep it-

Tim Fulton 30:01Well, you have to sort of be careful about the work of the BESA people-

Matthew Goldstein 30:05You got it

Tim Fulton 30:05... and the software people and, like-

Matthew Goldstein 30:06Has to be separate

Tim Fulton 30:07... so that it's not enduring to the benefit of anybody.

Matthew Goldstein 30:10100%.

Tim Fulton 30:11Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 30:11And so it gets, it becomes much more complicated, and we felt like we wanted to focus on really growing what we're trying to accomplish-

Tim Fulton 30:18Right

Matthew Goldstein 30:18... increasing engagement in our community-

Tim Fulton 30:20Right

Matthew Goldstein 30:21... and not get bogged down with this whole business aspect of it.

Tim Fulton 30:24Right.

Matthew Goldstein 30:24So it was decided, let's keep it as a nonprofit as long as possible with one team in place to really drive home that mission.

Tim Fulton 30:32I just wanna wrap up talking about sort of what your thoughts are on the Columbus nonprofit and giving and philanthropy community.

Matthew Goldstein 30:41Yeah.

Tim Fulton 30:41What's the lay of the land-

Matthew Goldstein 30:43Yeah

Tim Fulton 30:43... in the nonprofit space in Columbus?

Matthew Goldstein 30:46I think, uh, and in Columbus and across the country, it's difficult, right?

Tim Fulton 30:50Okay.

Matthew Goldstein 30:51You think about the recession, how that wiped out a lot of nonprofits.

Tim Fulton 30:54Right.

Matthew Goldstein 30:55But so many people working at nonprofits and working elsewhere are dedicated to uplifting our community. And so there are a lot of organizations in our community doing a lot of good work that just need our support.

Tim Fulton 31:08Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 31:09And so we have a giving community. Be it an individual or a business or, or even The Columbus Foundation, seventh-largest foundation in the world.

Tim Fulton 31:17Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 31:17Bill and Melinda Gates is number one. Number seven is right here in our community doing a lot of good work with hundreds of nonprofits.

Tim Fulton 31:25Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 31:25And so I think there's a lot of opportunity to do more good work. Here's the biggest problem or challenge that I see. There's so much need in our community, and the need far outpaces the resources that we have.

Tim Fulton 31:39Yeah.

Matthew Goldstein 31:39And the only way to tackle that is to get more people engaged. The more people engaged in, in addressing these big, hairy, ugly problems-

Tim Fulton 31:46Right

Matthew Goldstein 31:46... the more opportunity we have to solve problems. The nonprofits aren't gonna do it alone.

Tim Fulton 31:50You literally just said that the BHAG is the BHAG. The bi- the big, hairy, ugly problem is that we have a big, hairy, ugly problem. Which is good.

Matthew Goldstein 31:58I love it.

Tim Fulton 31:59No, I, I mean, it's good.

Matthew Goldstein 32:00Yes.

Tim Fulton 32:00And I think the point you're making is that it's about engagement, and it's not... So many people so many times are like, "I can't help. I, I can't afford to give money." Um, a lot of other people say, "I can't afford to give time." You know?

Matthew Goldstein 32:17Yeah.

Tim Fulton 32:17Like, I'm a fairly new dad.

Matthew Goldstein 32:18Yeah.

Tim Fulton 32:18That's a really difficult thi- for me to say, like, "I'm gonna dedicate a whole evening to an, a whole nother thing"-

Matthew Goldstein 32:24Yeah

Tim Fulton 32:24... is hard for me.

Matthew Goldstein 32:26A lot of people are in that position that they want to do it, right?

Tim Fulton 32:29Mm-hmm.

Matthew Goldstein 32:29You want to be a part of your community, but sometimes it's hard to figure out how you plug in.

Tim Fulton 32:33Right.

Matthew Goldstein 32:34So us as nonprofits I think can do even a better job of making it easier for you to plug in in your busy schedule in ways that are personal and significant to you.

Tim Fulton 32:43Well, and that's where BESA comes in, right?

Matthew Goldstein 32:44And that's where BESA comes in.

Tim Fulton 32:45Great. Matthew, thank you so much for your time today.

Matthew Goldstein 32:48Of course. Thank you for having us.

Tim Fulton 32:56Thank you for listening to the Confluence Cast presented by Columbus Underground. Again, you can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Please rate, subscribe, share this episode of the Confluence Cast with your friends, family, contacts, enemies, your favorite volunteer. If you're interested in sponsoring the Confluence Cast, get in touch with us. We can be reached by email at info@theconfluencecast.com. Our theme music was composed by Benji Robinson. Our producer is Philip Cogley. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. Have a great week.