Year in Review

Tim Fulton 00:07Welcome to the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. We are a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. This week, as we close out 2023 and prepare to start a new year, whatever it may bring, we are looking back on the highlights, lowlights, and trends that shaped our calendar year. To that end, Walker Evans, Susan Post, and I spent some time discussing the most impactful, interesting, and buzzworthy local stories of the past year. And listen in for an announcement or two during the episode. You can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Enjoy the interview. Sitting down here with Walker Evans, the co-founder and editor of Columbus Underground, and Columbus Underground and Metropreneur associate editor Susan Post. How are you guys? Good, how are you? Good. We are here rounding up the year, basically, in news and trends—not necessarily the best-read stories, but just sort of the things that had an impact this year.

Walker Evans 01:21Yeah, yeah. We kind of start to go back to the year at the end of every year, kind of looking back. And these are the big trends that jumped out at us.

Tim Fulton 01:28God bless analytics. Talk us through, first of all, the North Graveyard, all the stories that happened there. I will point people back to the original episode that we did with Jesse. But how has that developed over time?

Walker Evans 01:43Well, the original version was that he approached us and said, hey, I want to write about this. And we kind of thought, sure, knock yourself out. Like, if somebody reads it, that's great, but this sounds like something he was going to do for himself more than anyone else. And to our surprise, it was very well—

Susan Post 02:00Very, very well read. Yeah. I think there have been 10 articles now, and there's about to be an 11th. And Jesse has just done a phenomenal job of coming at it from a lot of different angles and talking to a lot of stakeholders involved in the project—from the archaeologists to the North Market to local Columbus ghost connoisseur Bucky Cutright. So it's been really fascinating to read them as they come in.

Walker Evans 02:25And I think it speaks to—sometimes I think we do take for granted that people do like learning more about the history of the city. And there's a lot of history there. And he's been really kind of delving into that category. So it's been great to see.

Tim Fulton 02:38Fair to say that there's a book coming out of this? It sounds—I wouldn't be surprised. Yeah. I think we can save how that licensing agreement works for the future. It's work for hire, after all. Next up on our list, the peninsula. Phase one is done after a decade of planning, and there's more to come.

Walker Evans 02:59Yeah, so the Scioto Peninsula—if you want to go way, way back, you can trace it back to the origins of the Franklinton floodwall, which was decided needed to be built like in the '60s or '70s. So it goes back a very long time. But development had been at a moratorium for the majority of Franklinton. Once that got approved, the city and county decided, we have all this land right there all around COSI, let's do something with it. So a lot of those planning efforts really got underway in like 2012, 2013, and phase one opened this year. So we've seen this rash of new development kind of boom, boom, boom throughout the summer—the hotel, the Junto opened, the different bars and stuff inside of that, the office building, the apartments. So, yeah, I know Susan's been to quite a few of the openings.

Susan Post 03:44Several times, yeah. And the Junto, you've got three different kinds of food and beverage options. You have the little Wester tavern on the ground floor, Madge's the coffee shop, and then we have yet another rooftop bar with Brass Eye. I got good views for Red, White, and Boom. Oh yeah, for sure. So it's exciting to see that filling in. And there's definitely more planned over the next couple of years that should be coming in over there. Like, Pins Mechanical will be moving their downtown location over there and backfilling the current space with a new concept. So eagerly awaiting to hear more on that.

Walker Evans 04:15And it's really nice too. It's funny, you hear people say things like, this feels like Bridge Park. And it's like, well, what you're saying is Bridge Park feels like a city. That's what you're saying. Because what's being built there is actually like city development sort of stuff. It's narrow roadways, kind of tighter areas, more pedestrian-centric. It's built right up against the park by COSI. So it feels really new and exciting over there. And also, I should say too, with the hotel, there's a couple of small retail bays in there that have not come online yet. So even in this first phase, they're not even done rolling out what will be happening in those buildings.

Susan Post 04:49Yeah, I think it's going to be exciting how it kind of bleeds into Franklinton too, and all the development that's going on at Gravity.

Walker Evans 04:56And then the DORA is also part of what's coming soon as well, because that will encompass that area as well. So you'll be able to sip a beverage and stroll around, and—

Tim Fulton 05:04All through downtown, apparently. Oh yeah. And frankly, all over the place across the bridge. Not all of downtown—

Walker Evans 05:09Not like the Discovery District, a lot of that guy is not in there. But okay.

Tim Fulton 05:13Yeah. Up next on the list, something a little bit less positive that we hoped would be East Market. For those that aren't familiar—I think there are folks that are not—talk through what the intention of East Market was and what has happened with that project over time.

Susan Post 05:33I wouldn't say it's not positive. I would just say anytime you're trying to build a brand new large-scale thing like that, you're going to have some ups and downs, and especially when you're working with food-based businesses—that's a really tough industry to begin with. So they've certainly had some vendor turnover and things like that. But I think it just takes time to build things like that up. But to answer your initial question, East Market isn't dissimilar from something like North Market, where you've got a large space that has a number of stalls and different vendors inside. Second floor has some seating area. There's also a couple of kind of in-house bars. So yeah, like I said, they have had some turnover, but they have a whole new slate of vendors that are coming in that I think is going to put them at capacity. And in talking with Aubrey Stephens, the leasing manager, they're making a conscious effort to kind of round things out. They're adding like a healthy food concept. There's burgers and wings now, there's a sandwich spot that's coming in. So I think they are trying to make sure this new wave is maybe a little more accessible for the neighborhood and has some more healthy options and just kind of rounds things out a little better. So I'm excited to see what the new year brings for that space as the newer vendors start coming online. So I'm hopeful. And you've got some other great restaurants surrounding it—you have CVC beer hall, Local Cantina. So maybe it hasn't been the smoothest year for that, but I still think it's a great addition to the neighborhood, taking these buildings that were vacant, and now there's something new and exciting there. So it's just going to take time.

Tim Fulton 07:08And do you attribute at least some of it to putting things in there, or folks going in there that don't necessarily fit with the neighborhood, and that wasn't the best? Or just not—what was the problem?

Susan Post 07:22I don't know if there's like a specific problem. I mean, I do think it's a little bit of a destination—you kind of have to make a conscious effort to go there. But it seems like you're going to add some more to that. Add some thoughts.

Walker Evans 07:35Yeah. I mean, I served on the board of directors at the North Market for six years. So I'm very in tune with the fact that there's a discrepancy between what people say they want and what they actually support. So everyone says, we want grocery, grocery, grocery, produce, meat counters. And then what people end up buying is prepared food, right? There's this romantic idea of, oh, an urban downtown city market should be the same thing that it was in 1887. And the reality is that you go into your average Kroger, Giant Eagle, Whole Foods, they've leaned more prepared food over the past 20 years, because that's where customer trends have gone, and that's where the margin is. And so I think there's a discrepancy between what people say they want out of a market and what they actually will get, because at the end of the day, it's really tough to make money on produce. Especially as a small operator, you're never going to sell apples cheaper than what Kroger can.

Tim Fulton 08:35So at the end of the day, folks speak with their dollars.

Walker Evans 08:38So I don't think it's been negative. I know there's been some turnover, and so you're always going to have people online complaining about stuff. But I think it's really become a neighborhood asset with the opening this year of CVC and Local Cantina and kind of rounding out the pedestrian areas, that footprint, Leisure Club, and then the co-working next year.

Susan Post 09:01I mean, there are a couple of vendors in the market that have expanded within the market since they've been there, like Kotta opened Little Kotta, and then also the Taste of Greece and Marrakesh street food, they're involved in the new burger spot. And Bearded Baker has expanded several times since they've been in there. So some of them seem to be doing really well.

Tim Fulton 09:23Okay. Yeah. Next on the list—and again, we're in no particular order—but 10th anniversaries for Columbus Underground. Round of applause, certainly, for Susan Post. 10 years here. Brent Warren also.

Walker Evans 09:36Maria Bowers Abbott, our food critic, and Hope Madden, our movie critic, both came on 10 years ago. I say this every once in a while—I don't think a lot of people know this, but they both came to us from The Other Paper. So The Other Paper closed 10 years ago, January of 2013. Has it been that long? Yeah. And they basically, the very next week, just transitioned over and continued working with us.

Tim Fulton 09:57There you go. Yeah. Some big—well, Susan, first of all, congrats.

Susan Post 10:03Yeah, I can't believe it's been 10 years. It's gone very fast, but it's been great. It's been a lot of fun. And I've had the opportunity to do a lot of stuff over 10 years, and I really enjoy it. So it's been a good time to get to work around all of these other great folks that have been around for a long time. So it's cool to get to work with people that are really passionate and knowledgeable about what they're writing about.

Tim Fulton 10:25Yeah. And a little bit more into the business of Columbus Underground, we have here on the list, TikTok. We're on TikTok. Yes. How's that, whether we want to be or not?

Walker Evans 10:37Well, we've had a TikTok account for a couple of years. Like, anytime any new platform launches, the first thing you do is get in there and claim your username, right, before somebody else does. Which is why we have a Threads social account, just to have our name on there, so nobody else has it.

Tim Fulton 10:51Oh, wow. Yeah. Okay, I didn't know that.

Walker Evans 10:54I don't think we have any followers, don't post anything on there, but just so no one else takes our name and posts bad things. But yeah, so we never really used TikTok much. We had a great video editing intern this summer—shout out to Cory for all of his help with that. But we started posting some videos on there, seeing what people engage with, and what turned out to be really popular were these silly "Long Last But Not Completely Gone" food destinations with our friend Jesse Yost, friend of the show. And yeah, so the couple of big ones we've done collectively 2.5 million views. Okay. Yeah, that's nothing to sneeze at. No, no. I call that viral on a local level. But the Ponderosa visit was very well viewed—so bad. There's only one left in central Ohio, on South High Street. So we went down there, and we went to the York Steakhouse on the west side. That was very well watched. We went to Rax down in Lancaster—there's only a handful of Rax left. We went to Arthur Treacher's—there's only two of those left, that's just outside of Akron in Cuyahoga Falls. Okay, not quite as well viewed. And more recent, but we went to Quiznos. There's only two Quiznos left in the entire state. There used to be like 30 in central Ohio. There was a Quiznos on every corner. There's one on the Cap. Do you remember that? Yes, right in the Short North. Yeah, there was a Quiznos, and I think a Cold—

Susan Post 12:24I feel like—or maybe that wasn't—the gateway? Yeah. Okay. But anyway.

Walker Evans 12:30There's only two Quiznos left in Ohio, and we went to one. And people have feelings about these things.

Tim Fulton 12:34Well, that's a testament to engagement rate. And like, you don't necessarily know how things are going to turn out. I will take this opportunity to give a little plug that the Confluence Cast is now on YouTube. So it's available. We were just having a discussion beforehand about, like, hey, audio listeners seem a little soft right now, but the video views are way up. So you basically put content wherever you think folks are going to be, and sometimes you don't know.

Walker Evans 13:04Yeah, right. And sometimes it takes that 60-second YouTube short to get someone's attention and then realize, like, oh, this is a podcast, and I can get it on iTunes—or Apple, I guess iTunes isn't really a thing anymore. I still call it iTunes, just like Twitter and X. But yeah, you never know how you get people's attention.

Tim Fulton 13:24Yeah. Do you want to talk about—so we were talking also about your social media philosophy, and how it takes a lot of time to post this stuff, right? And you have sort of made the decision, and I think this will be revealing a bit, that Columbus Underground, while it will retain its username, is not going to be posting on Twitter that much.

Walker Evans 13:42Yeah, we've been kind of going back and forth with it all year. One, it's gotten to be a really bad place under Elon Musk, partly because of his leadership decisions, and partly because of the things that he says himself on there. But also, the engagement is down, the amount of traffic it drives to our website is down, and it has been on that trajectory even before him. So it's really become a time sink that we don't really see a lot of value in.

Tim Fulton 14:09And other news outlets, specifically NPR, have pointed out, like, we didn't lose any traffic when we left. It was minimal. So up next, Walker, you've been diving deep into shopping malls and retail specifically, and the rise and fall of Westland. Can we talk through that a little bit?

Walker Evans 14:29Yeah. And again, there's a great podcast interview with Doug Motz about Eastland, which kind of kicked the news off, because that closed right at the tail end of 2022. So there was a lot of discussion about what's going to happen next with Eastland. The city's still trying to figure that out. That'll probably move faster than Westland, because Eastland was located within the city of Columbus, whereas Westland was located in Franklin Township. So they've never had really the money, the budget, the political push, maybe, to get that site demolished, redeveloped, well taken care of.

Tim Fulton 15:00Well taken care of.

Walker Evans 15:01But they did acquire funding from the state of Ohio, so demolition, I think, has begun. I haven't driven out there in a minute, I'm not sure. So the big question I had at the beginning of the year was, well, that makes Tuttle now our oldest mall, and it's only 26 years old, but it's starting to kind of falter. And so we've done some more investigating into that, and that's been a very well-read ongoing story throughout the course of the year.

Susan Post 15:24And just before we started this podcast, found out a couple more stores are closing within Tuttle. So yeah. And I can't remember the last time I've been there, which I guess kind of—

Walker Evans 15:37Yeah. But I think a lot of people don't even realize too, that the owner, the most recent owner, Simon, walked away from the mall, basically just said it was in receivership. And that was maybe like April of 2020, if I'm remembering correctly. So at the start of the pandemic, they just kind of walked away from it. So it's been court-controlled, without an owner, for the past three years, and there was a court-appointed management company just kind of keeping the lights on. So it doesn't seem like they're actively recruiting new tenants. They're just sort of like barely sweeping the floors. So they did finally find an owner after almost three years of not having an owner. And I don't think they're mall operators, the three ownership companies. They're more just like a financial ownership arrangement. So it's private equity.

Tim Fulton 16:33I rolled my eyes at it.

Walker Evans 16:38I mean, I don't know much about them. But generally speaking, that doesn't bode well for the future of something that needs dedicated mall ownership and management.

Tim Fulton 16:47Yeah. And I'm curious—I guess this is a good opportunity to bring it up—like, folks don't tend to comment a whole lot anymore, right, like they do on Facebook and stuff like that. But frankly, they do on YouTube, I'm discovering. But at least the podcast, I will readily admit, eight of the top 10 podcasts are about development. And it's always like, oh, I want to know. And I don't have a good sense—and maybe you do—about why that is, about why a local celebrity done good, or an artist, or frankly even just a business, or history does well, but not as well. Why do you think development stories kind of pop off like that?

Walker Evans 17:38I mean, I think they represent, like, massive changes in the city, you know? For better or worse. I mean, some people see it in terms of gentrification, traffic, affordability, and some people see it as, oh, this decrepit land or building or area is being reborn, and that's exciting.

Susan Post 17:59I think something is going up and you want to know what it is. Curious.

Tim Fulton 18:03And do you see—and this is a "yes, and" to that—it basically helps people feel like they're in the know, like, oh, I know what's going in there, or I know what's happening there. I know where the latest Sheetz will be. Not that you guys do that kind of reporting, but that kind of reporting does exist.

Walker Evans 18:21And I've kind of boiled this down to some extent. Like, when we look analytically at our best-read stories on Columbus Underground, it's development and food. And we do spend a lot of time writing about the arts, and local theater, and civics and stuff. But at the end of the day, human beings need to live—they should live in a house—and consume food. You don't have to buy a piece of art every day. You don't have to go see the ballet every day. All of that sort of stuff kind of falls by the wayside. But the things that are kind of like human essentials rise to the top.

Tim Fulton 18:55Well, I think that's an argument for more food podcasts. So there we go. Yeah, yeah, let's do another run at it.

Walker Evans 19:01Can do it.

Tim Fulton 19:03Up next, the elections. We interviewed every city council candidate, we interviewed the two mayoral candidates that were on the ballot, and we put them all out over the course of four weeks. And it was a lot.

Walker Evans 19:17And you say "we," but you did 90% of the work. Yeah, fair. I'm just giving you—

Tim Fulton 19:24It was a goal, and we got it done. I would like to think of it as my art project for the year.

Walker Evans 19:28Yeah. I'm not sure if any other media outlet in town did that extensive of a job covering the elections.

Tim Fulton 19:36I don't think—I mean, the Dispatch certainly did their thing, and they did their questionnaire, or at least put it out there. But no, that was kind of a trip, right? Like, every single one of them. And yeah, I had to send a couple follow-up emails, sure, but every single one of them came in, sat down right here, and gave us their time. And so, props to them, thanks to them for doing that, certainly. And it helped sort of relaunch the Confluence Cast here, and those were the first episodes that were on YouTube. So it's good. Glad we did it.

Walker Evans 20:09It was a fun process.

Tim Fulton 20:10We did it. Up next on the list I have here, just planning in general. So this is basically structural planning. This is LinkUS, which we just did an episode about, Amtrak, zoning, Vision Zero, Rapid 5. All of that. Everything seems to be moving forward.

Walker Evans 20:32I don't think I even had on the list here, the Downtown Development Plan update from 2022. So, I mean, lots of it's very nerdy technical stuff, but highly, highly important. And yeah, it was cool to see updates like all year long on all this stuff.

Susan Post 20:46A lot of future-shaping things.

Tim Fulton 20:49As someone who follows this stuff pretty closely—obviously, we can talk to Brent more about it— Oh, sure. He's the real deal.

Walker Evans 20:58He's the real deal. Follow-up episode just with Brent, yeah.

Tim Fulton 21:02At least in your perspective—and Susan, I want you to weigh in here too—is enough being done? First of all, I think I know the answer to this: is enough being done? And two, is the work that's being done being done well?

Walker Evans 21:14I think it depends upon which plan we're talking about, because they're different groups, and they all overlap, they all have to interconnect. I think there's a lot of really good, important stuff being done with LinkUS. I think everyone seems very positive that we will hear some positive news about Amtrak. I mean, we can plan all day long, but that relies upon the federal government to get back to us on that—maybe even before this podcast comes out. But some of that's out of our control. I think there have been a couple missed opportunities with, not zoning, Vision Zero. It's supposed to be about reducing pedestrian deaths, and there are a couple instances where we're tearing down buildings to widen roads, so traffic can continue to go fast. And I think that runs very counter with that. And I think to some degree, it's the left hand, right hand doesn't know what each other's doing across city departments and stuff. So I think they have to continue to work to rein some of that in, to really make a difference. And then rezoning, it's kind of divided into this two-part thing, a phase one and phase two. Personally speaking, purely personally speaking, I think it should be going faster. I think we should just have one phase and get it all done right away. I understand why we're doing it that way, but it's one of those—it's going to become a problem really quick. Like, housing is already becoming unaffordable, it's going to get worse if we don't move fast, and I'd love to see us move faster.

Susan Post 22:41And then, as someone that's not as well versed in this stuff, I would say I see a lot of planning, and I'm excited to see more action in the coming years. And I feel like a lot of people forget that all of this stuff takes a lot of time and a lot of planning and a lot of money. And it's not just going to happen overnight. And you can certainly get frustrated waiting for it, but I'm excited to see how some of these bigger things come together in the long run.

Walker Evans 23:05Yeah. A great example of that is the Downtown Development Plan, summer of 2022, when this stuff was announced. A lot of that has to do with just updating infrastructure. And so a good example is turning more one-way streets into two-way streets, which we've done some of. Gay Street right down below is a great one, which was like 17 years ago, we did that. Fast forward a full year to summer of 2023, and the city says, okay, the first one we're going to do is this chunk of Front Street, from Broad to Hickory, and a piece of Marconi, because there's a couple of blocks where it's one way for just a few blocks and two way on both sides. There's really no reason it needs to be one way. So they announced, this is where we're going to—

Tim Fulton 23:43And it's three or four lanes already, right?

Walker Evans 23:48We're almost in December, and it still hasn't happened yet. So, like, is the first thing going to be done in 2024 from the 2022 plan? Does it really take two years to turn three blocks of a street from two-way to one? It feels like it's going at a snail's pace. And so I think people feel this frustration sometimes.

Tim Fulton 24:06Yeah. Pivoting a lot. You identified very early in the year—and you were sort of getting in my ear about it, and I was like, yeah, sure—talking about comedy. And you were like—I think what I heard, and I don't think this is what you said, is what I heard—it's actually really good. And I was like, okay, cool. And you encouraged me to come out to some shows, and you've gotten a couple folks to come out to a couple of shows, and a lot more coverage on Columbus Underground. And I feel like, in addition to seeing you, I am hearing a lot more about comedy. So I guess, why the focus? And is there something actually different, or are we just realizing now that it's burgeoning?

Walker Evans 24:58I think there's a couple of things that are different. I think there's sort of the pent-up demand—people spent a lot of time locked in during the pandemic, people want to get out and do things again. So there's that. The social media platforms trending toward short-form video has been kind of a godsend for comedians who can post like 30-second, one-minute clips. It's great for stand-up to be elevated onto those spaces in a way that it wasn't before, and that's TikTok, Instagram Reels, YouTube Shorts, Facebook Stories, all of that stuff. But also, the level that groups like the Attic opening—hashtag just opened their space, which is improv, but they also do some stand-up events—the Don't Tell group that runs those events in the city, like really knocking it out of the park. So there is a little bit of a local anomaly going on as well. And all these things are sort of starting to gel in a way that I just think it's really cool to see.

Tim Fulton 25:59And do you happen to have plans for next year for how you want to insert yourself, or Columbus Underground, into that scene?

Walker Evans 26:10I mean, there'll be—prior authorization, in January, we'll be announcing some stuff. I guess this could be a little tidbit for those listening to the podcast. So Columbus Underground does some event production. Our largest event is the Columbus Coffee Festival, which we just did our eighth year—8,500 people in attendance over two days. So it's become a pretty big thing. And so we're always thinking about, what is Columbus missing? We don't want to just do another beer festival, because there's plenty of those. So a comedy festival seems like a good idea. And so we're talking with everyone from the Funny Bone at Easton to the Attic, Don't Tell, to the improv groups, Shadowbox, NAST, about what that will look like for next year. So more details to come. But yeah, we really just want to put our arms around everyone and get everyone on board and make sure everyone gets uplifted.

Tim Fulton 27:06Next up on our list, Cameron Mitchell and the stuff that that organization has been doing. Susan, if you want to speak to what they've been busy with. Busy, yeah.

Susan Post 27:16So Cameron Mitchell opened two new restaurants in central Ohio this year. Valentina's out at Bridge Park, which to me is kind of like a cross between Marcella's and Martini. And then Trenta in German Village, which is definitely kind of swinging for the fences, a little more upscale. So those opened pretty close to each other. And then they have two more restaurants announced for central Ohio. There's Butcher and Rose, which is going to go in the Preston center downtown. So it's going to be a steakhouse, looking like it's going to be pretty impressive. They've done a ton of work on that building.

Tim Fulton 27:52I'm sorry, what is the Preston center?

Walker Evans 27:54So the PNC Plaza. Ah, yeah, okay.

Susan Post 27:58It's going to be, I think, some sort of glass enclosure situation. And then they're also working on a Mediterranean concept at Easton. And there's been a little bit of to-do about this, because the building permit's listed as Del Mar. And they haven't confirmed that that's what it's going to be, but the Del Mar in Florida is more Mediterranean than the one we have here.

Tim Fulton 28:24So someone may rebrand, or it may just be a whole new concept.

Susan Post 28:29Yeah. So we'll see. So more on the horizon.

Tim Fulton 28:33There you go. And then last, at least on our looking-back list, demolition and preservation. Some buildings saved, some buildings lost. Maybe this is our In Memoriam sort of section of the episode.

Walker Evans 28:49I mean, there are some things like the ice house building downtown in the warehouse district—we lost a warehouse in the warehouse district, which a lot of people were pretty bummed to learn that building was coming down. But I think it put some attention back into what it takes to save some of those types of properties. Brent has played a great role in kind of helping to shine a light whenever anything is even like a whiff of demolition is starting to happen. A great example of that is the Ohio State University hospital system announced they were going to tear down the Hamilton-Henderson house—the Hanford, the Henderson house over there on Taylor Avenue. Historic, especially within the Black-owned business community, this historic property. And Brent wrote about, hey, they're considering this, and everyone got pretty irate. And then they said, maybe we won't tear that down, maybe we'll do something else, because they have a lot of land over there. They don't have to tear that building down. So some proactive journalism in that realm has played a nice role. And the next thing—I mentioned earlier this year, but I want to dedicate some more time to it—is the original Spaghetti Warehouse building, which is collapsing on itself, and if nobody takes any action, it's also probably going to be demolished. And that's a pretty significant building in Franklinton that could be saved and restored. So it's a never-ending battle, but I think more and more people are paying attention to that sort of stuff.

Tim Fulton 30:16Wrapping things up today, what are you looking forward to, in addition to whatever the comedy festival turns out to look like? What are you looking forward to in 2024?

Walker Evans 30:27I mean, we have some other events kind of changing, growing, that sort of stuff. So that's on top of mind, on the horizon. We've been in the process of interviewing to hire some new freelancers. And a big categorical push behind that is local music coverage. I know we sat down and talked about this a while back. So we want to really kick the year off with kind of focusing on that in a new way, and really shining a spotlight back on that creative part of the community.

Tim Fulton 30:59Yeah. And I will say, at least for the Confluence Cast part, I want to, first of all, maintain the consistency that we've had. Success breeds success in that realm. And also step it up a little bit in terms of—we've, thankfully, you let me use this conference room every Thursday afternoon—but have more folks come in that folks are interested in hearing about. The goal has always been to elevate people and ideas and happenings that people may not know about, but also, there's nothing wrong with letting them hear from the folks they want to hear from. So, as always, if folks have ideas, they're welcome to email or comment or reach out. So, cool. Great. Thank you guys for your time. Yeah, thank you. Thanks, Tim. Thank you for listening to the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. Again, you can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Please rate, subscribe, and share this episode of the Confluence Cast with your friends, family, contacts, enemies, your favorite reporter. If you're interested in sponsoring the Confluence Cast, get in touch with us. We can be reached by email at info@theconfluencecast.com. Our theme music was composed by Benji Robinson, our producer is Philip Cogley. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. Have a Happy New Year.