Multidisciplinary Artist Lisa Mclymont

Tim Fulton 00:11Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. We are a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. This week, a conversation about the power of art and artists to change perceptions. I spoke with multidisciplinary artist, graphic designer, and social justice advocate Lisa McClymont to discuss her background, her path as an artist, how she chooses her work so that it remains aligned with herself and finds purpose, and her work on the Columbus Art Commission. Also, this episode starts with a mini episode, if you will, the first in a series of bite-sized conversations with the staffers at Columbus Underground about timely issues that may not warrant a whole show. Today we're talking about the bike lane discussions that are taking place in Clintonville and around the city with Columbus Underground owner Walker Evans. You can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Also, the Confluence Cast is on Patreon. Find out how to support this podcast on our website, theconfluencecast.com, or at patreon.com/confluence. The Confluence Cast is sponsored this week by Art Makes Columbus / Columbus Makes Art, featuring stories about our city's incredible artists, stories full of inspiration, challenge, passion, and success. For videos, articles, an up-to-the-minute calendar of events, and an artist directory, visit columbusmakesart.com, the resource for all things arts and culture in the capital city. Enjoy the episode. Sitting down here virtually with the proprietor of Columbus Underground, Mr. Walker Evans. Walker, how are you, sir?

Walker Evans 02:14I'm pretty good. How you doing?

Tim Fulton 02:15I'm pretty good. You know, at some point, I just thought of this, and I don't know why I never did. We should just do an episode on you and Columbus Underground and the background and how it started and all that stuff. But that's not what we're talking about. Do people want to hear that? They do. They like to know how the sausage is made?

Walker Evans 02:37Funnily enough, since you mentioned that, I collaboratively did a podcast interview probably three or four years ago. Everything feels like it was a million years ago at this point. But three or four years ago, with Rita Volpi, who is the wife of Eric Brembeck. They both own Studio 35.

Tim Fulton 03:01Oh, you're giving a little preview here.

Walker Evans 03:05Two degrees of separation in Columbus. Everyone's good, everyone.

Tim Fulton 03:10Absolutely. Absolutely. We're talking about bike lanes. Yep. Today, inspired by, at first I believe, a little Facebook uprising.

Walker Evans 03:23Yeah, I mean, the specific bike lane that you're referring to, the one that I was referring to as well, in front of Studio 35, is a part of a larger road-reworking plan for Indianola, just to make it a better route to travel. People drive very fast on it. Nothing's really been done with the street for a long time. And so this goes back to meetings in 2015, when they were talking about road diets, bike lanes, all this sort of stuff. But yeah, there was a bit of a kerfuffle, I think, in real life and on social media. And now that it's close to happening, there's starting to be a little bit of an uproar.

Tim Fulton 04:00So Eric, the owner of Studio 35, put up a post kind of not being in favor of this bike lane or this reworking, because it takes away parking spaces.

Walker Evans 04:14Yeah. At the end of the day, there's a lot of nuanced detail to how both sides — I'm using finger quotes, "sides" — are taking on the issue. But the plan was to remove parking on one side of the street, the east side, so opposite of Studio 35 and the other row of businesses, while preserving the parking on their side of the street to allow enough room for the installation of bike lanes going north and south on Indianola. So Eric was the most vocal, but some of the other businesses are kind of all set together, like, we don't want to lose this parking. People are going to have to park in the neighborhoods. It's going to be an issue for the neighbors. And I think they have a point. I think also a lot of small businesses, especially movie theaters, small movie theaters, are coming out of two years of hardship, right? The pandemic. Their business has been hit very, very hard. And so to just say, hey, half your parking is gonna be gone, deal with it —

Tim Fulton 05:16It's another thing that there —

Walker Evans 05:18Yeah, yeah. So if this were something happening five years ago, maybe the concern wouldn't be as much. But when everybody's just going through a really hard time, you don't want one more problem on top of existing problems. And I think that's probably added to the fuel to the fire.

Tim Fulton 05:37And I think it's easy for folks to have a reaction to something like that, that is, who could possibly be against bike lanes?

Walker Evans 05:48Right, right. And I think Eric even said, in some of his arguments, like, I'm not against the bike lane, we just need to figure out some way, whether it's shared road access through there. He basically just doesn't want the parking to go away. But he's a pro-bike-lane guy. I think just the way it's going to impact his businesses is an issue. And the other side, the transit advocates that are fighting for it, and the neighbors that want it too, they point to studies that have been done in other cities that show that bike lanes can actually have an increase in business. You know, it feels weird to also have this discussion in the middle of winter. It's like, let's build a bike lane. It's like, well, it's 10 degrees outside. But it's one of those things where you can't prove the demand for it until it exists. You could look at the road and say, well, no one's riding their bikes right now, so why do we build a bike lane? It's like, well, they're not riding bikes because there's no safe way. People driving 45 miles an hour on Indianola? No one's gonna ride bikes on that.

Tim Fulton 06:54I mean, as a kid who grew up on Indianola, there's no biking in the street. It's not right.

Walker Evans 07:01And there's only a stoplight, like, every mile in a stretch of Indianola, too. So cars are just — it's a freeway, it's a highway in the middle of a neighborhood. This is really just the latest. And so this isn't a uniquely Columbus issue. Other cities are going through these kinds of things. This isn't the first bike lane uproar in Columbus. It's also not the only one going on right now, but it's getting the most attention. There's a bike lane proposal in Bexley — so not in Columbus, but in Bexley, on Drexel Avenue, I believe, connecting between Broad and Main. Not as many businesses impacted, but the residents there, the churches, the schools that are along that street are all very upset, because they would lose a lot of parking on both sides of the street. But again, Bexley's mayor has come out and said, you know, we can't just continue to drive like we have. We have to make changes, and there's going to be some pain points. It's going to take a little getting used to. Maybe you do have to park another 100 feet away and walk. We just can't be a car-centric city. If you took a survey of the general public and said, should Columbus be less car-centric, should we have better transportation options, almost everyone would say yes. And then it comes to, like, do you want this bike lane in front of your house or business or whatever? And they're like, no, I don't want it right here.

Tim Fulton 08:24It feels like NIMBYism, right? It's like, should we have affordable housing? Of course we should. Should it be next door to your house? That would hurt my home value? No. Right.

Walker Evans 08:35So yeah, it's a tough situation. I can definitely see it from both sides. I think the big issue too is that if this were a bike lane in front of a big box store, there would be less sympathy for the business. If they said, oh, we're gonna lose 10% of our business at Walmart, most people would say, who cares? You guys make billions and billions of dollars. So it's tough when it's small businesses impacted by this, because Studio 35 is a gem. It's been a theater, I think, for almost 100 years, right? No one wants to see it shut down. So there has to be some sort of plan or consideration to help them get through that pain point, those businesses there. And I don't know what that looks like, but helping them go from point A to point B. Transportation on there, I guess.

Tim Fulton 09:34We've got to find the route to make this work.

Walker Evans 09:37That's right. Get everyone on board.

Tim Fulton 09:41Exactly. There are also so many transportation buttons.

Walker Evans 09:44That's a bus pun, not a bike pun. Let's get rolling on this.

Tim Fulton 09:51And this is exactly the kind of issue to discuss in this forum, because there are multiple sides to it, and either side could have some aggression towards the other.

Walker Evans 10:05Yeah, yeah. I mean, people are pretty heated about this, which sounds silly, because it's just a bike lane. But I think it's nice just to have a conversation about what's going on. Don't need to devote an entire podcast episode to this, but a nice little bite-sized conversation.

Tim Fulton 10:24So there you go. That's what's going on with the bike lane issue.

Walker Evans 10:30Yeah, we've been covering it on Columbus Underground. I'm sure there'll be more updates too. So check out the website for some written pieces in the future.

Tim Fulton 10:37Absolutely. Thanks, Walker. Yeah, thanks for sitting down here virtually. Sitting down with Columbus-based artist Lisa McClymont. Lisa, how are you?

Lisa Mclymont 10:50I'm wonderful. Thank you. Thanks for inviting me.

Tim Fulton 10:54Absolutely. So first of all, tell us your background and the work that you do.

Lisa Mclymont 11:00Well, in summary, I am a self-taught artist who worked as a graphic designer, mostly independent, for about 25 years, and I use some of my design skills to inform my artworks, my visual works.

Tim Fulton 11:21And was this commercial graphic design that you were doing?

Lisa Mclymont 11:23All sorts. Yeah. From supporting other artists to corporate-level, doing full branding, brand guidelines, environmental signage. I really covered the full range. Whenever somebody needed something done for their brand, they could call on me, and I would figure out a way to do it.

Tim Fulton 11:45Gotcha. And what's your personal background? Where do you come from?

Lisa Mclymont 11:49I was born in New York to two immigrant parents. So I am a child of immigrants. My sister and I were both born in New York, and our parents got divorced when we were six, and we came here because a lot of my father's family was here. He moved back to New York years later, but after college, my sister and I both stayed. So my sister lives in Sunbury, and I cut my teeth here. My artist self, my designer self, and everything happened here in Columbus. I went to Columbus City Schools. Independence, yes.

Tim Fulton 12:27Nice. Okay. So that neighborhood, then, too?

Lisa Mclymont 12:31Well, I moved around a lot. Not — I was not an army brat, it was just we moved around a lot. So in high school, that was the first time in my whole history that we'd stayed anywhere for a full time. All four years at that high school. But before that, I was never more than a year or two years in any school between New York and here, which was kind of amazing.

Tim Fulton 12:52Gotcha. Were you doing visual art on the side during that career, or was this a life transition?

Lisa Mclymont 13:00Oh, I was in the class of kids that were taught to do one thing and learn to do it well, and I got burnout trying to do that well. So I reached for art as my therapy and was able to make a bridge for myself, just saying yes to lots of different things to try them. And it's really unlocked a whole new way of working for myself. And how long has that been? Since 2009. Yeah, it's crazy. I say a lot that I broke my life to get here. So a lot of what I'm doing, I would not be doing if I hadn't gone through what I went through.

Tim Fulton 13:41So can you talk through that a little bit?

Lisa Mclymont 13:44I was having a lot of trouble getting purchase. I think a lot of it too was being a Black gay woman in a very white, very male industry, like design. Columbus — there's not a lot of me in there. Or people like me. So trying to get a hold of bigger jobs just became harder and harder to do. And I got more and more depressed, and I was wearing it. So I got to the point where I let go of a lot of clients and lost a lot of money and spent the last of what I had as a 401(k). I was actually living off of that for like two or three years. Lots of very emotional stuff. And the reach for art — I know that I have friends that say art saves lives, and I definitely am one of those types of people. I grew up in the power of art to shift perceptions, to help people make change. So what I do with my art is I make something and I envision myself giving it away, because that was key for me too. I think before 2009 I was making things but then holding them and not sharing them with anybody in the world. I called myself an artist, but I really wasn't activating that part of myself. I'll also say in 2009 I had been on social media for maybe a year, and I have to credit sharing on social media as part of my letting-go process and part of letting people into what I was doing. And I think that is part of how I gained support to become more of myself. So it's been an amazing journey since then.

Tim Fulton 15:34And so talk about your work. At least according to your website, you're primarily focused on portraiture and murals?

Lisa Mclymont 15:43Yes. That is the majority of my work right now. Before, when I was breaking into things, I was definitely one of those "I'm scared to do faces and hands" type of artists. So I made lots of color field, ethereal things, abstract landscapes. I had a stint of doing jewelry, and I was starting to go somewhere with it, but it was very physical work. So I still love copper — I'm curious — but I'm not hammering metal like that anymore. So I pretty much stopped doing that. And then that same year, I reached for the portraits, and I assigned myself my first body of work. So I was like, Lisa, you're gonna explore different people of color, and you're going to explore hands and expressions. And I chose to look at the chakras too. I was really into New Age interests, and that was a good way to use color to establish a body of work. So I went through the chakras, and I thought about what color and meaning mean, and what that might look like as far as an emotion. And I just kind of put all that together into this body of 15 works and was able to launch from that. I think that is squarely — the Universe Tribe is squarely — the body of work that helped me become me today. And I chose to do that. I made that path for myself. And I think that's a very powerful thing to be able to tell somebody.

Tim Fulton 17:09And so was that meant to challenge yourself?

Lisa Mclymont 17:13Yeah. It was finally the, like, you're gonna learn how to do expressions, you're going to learn how to work with hands, you're going to learn to do all these things, and quit being scared of it. And at that point, Trayvon had been killed, and all these things were happening politically. And I felt like putting paragraphs in titles of my abstract artworks wasn't really it anymore. So I really had to figure out how to shift what I was doing visually to get at what I really wanted to start talking about, or help people shift into talking about.

Tim Fulton 17:48I didn't know before this conversation — you and I know each other personally, to an extent — I didn't know that you were not a trained artist.

Lisa Mclymont 17:55Yeah. Most people think I went to CCAD and I got a free ride to OSU. I went to design because back in the day, for me, you couldn't just be an artist. Like, how are you going to make any money, how are you going to live? So I became a designer, and I learned how to be an entrepreneur, thanks to being here in Columbus. And I still utilize a lot of that. I'm just not trying so hard to be just a graphic designer. I'm more of a multi-hyphenate type of person.

Tim Fulton 18:25Well, what's interesting to me is that you do a good job of presenting your work in both a commercial collector space, but also, in my head, in a contemporary art space, in that you can talk about your work.

Lisa Mclymont 18:43Wow. That, I've been working hard to figure out — the storytelling part of my work, and talking about my work as well. It's a constant journey.

Tim Fulton 18:52It's a lot of what, at least my perception, having worked in contemporary art before — certainly not as an artist, but as a marketer — knowing that a whole bunch of it is just, how does this fit within the zeitgeist? How does this fit within the contemporary art space? And that's what plants your flag. Where do you think you got that from?

Lisa Mclymont 19:18Well, I like to think — I do say I'm curious and empathetic. A problem solver. And my design knowledge, my design training, has given me access to ways to utilize collecting info and then reformatting it to something that others can use. So I'm definitely using my designer self as I approach making art. And I feel like that is where I'm coming from when I do talk about the art, because there are a lot of art business people that don't want the touchy-feely stuff. Like, I did this piece because my heart was broken, blah blah blah — that doesn't mean as much to someone as, like, this is getting at police brutality, right? It's another emotional way to look at a thing and talk about a thing, and it's a little less personal. So I'm in a time now where I'm trying to step away and step into the statement of the work, as opposed to me making a statement about my emotional state.

Tim Fulton 20:23I'm sorry, what's the name of the group of the 15 portraits?

Lisa Mclymont 20:26Universe Tribe. So the Universe Tribe, Woman Strong, is where I started. And Tribe still has a presence in my work, my portrait work, but it's more of the mythological people, the spirits that kind of talk to parts of living, or, you know, hope or empathy or love, like those things. But then there's a part of my portraiture that I call the Odes, where I'm looking at living and past heroes of mine in the world, to showcase and bring light to them. Like Audre Lorde was a big one for me. Octavia Butler, who is now getting lots of credit in the world. She didn't have that when I first found her, and I read all her books, and I just loved what she was about — the sociology, how she wrote from a Black woman's perspective, how she wrote into the future, the way we could live more positively. That was — she was writing another way to look at, and me being a Trekkie, because that's what I love about Star Trek, the Next Generation, is how they put a spin on how we could be as humans. That was just — it wasn't a dystopia.

Tim Fulton 21:45Right, maybe it could be a good outlook.

Lisa Mclymont 21:49Well, it's good, there's good and bad. There's still strife. We're gonna always have that. But how do you deal with it? How do you reframe it so it's useful for you? Sci-fi helped that for me. Octavia, Star Trek, all of that really helped me expand what I wanted to be in the world, or how I wanted to look at the world, how I want the world to look at me.

Tim Fulton 22:11Yeah. So when you set out for this project, did you define it all from the outset, like, I'm going to do 15 of these?

Lisa Mclymont 22:21I did, because I like multiples of three. I work in multiples of three. It's a weird thing that I've got. Sometimes some fall by the wayside. I think I originally went for 24 or 18, or something like that, and I had sketches, and they just kind of, like — I'm not going to go for that. It actually was 18. And there are three that I can think of — one I sanded down, I just used the board for something else. But they don't all survive. I try for some things and then bring them all along, and not all of them make it to that end. I might put that idea away and then revisit it later when I go for my next body of work or the next chapter in that series.

Tim Fulton 22:58And so were you able to be purposeful from the outset? I'm always super interested in, like, how do you work? From the outset, were you able to set a timeline? Did you map out, like, here's what these 18 are gonna be?

Lisa Mclymont 23:16I mapped them out. I have a little matrix of, like, here's some colors I want to work with. These are my go-tos. I knew I wanted to work on wood, because at that point I decided I didn't really like working on canvas. I knew I needed a body of work, so I needed more than like six to nine pieces to make it solid. And I set the intention of the healing of myself, as well as putting that out to the world, in the hopes that I could shift somebody else's perception of themselves and of Black people. Because really, it comes down to expanding the monolith of Black people. I think there's a lot of people that still think Black people, and they're this, you know. At that point — that was 2015, when I started the Universe Tribe series. So five to six years into my self-taught self, it was time to really get into the meat of it. And that's how I chose to do that.

Tim Fulton 24:16And so did you know, at that point —

Lisa Mclymont 24:20I had no timeline either. I have a time for a thing, and then I work in spurts. So I'll just carve out some time from my schedule. And at that point I was doing some freelance. I wasn't working full-time. So I was just going with the flow as much as possible. When I had some mental time, I was trying to get into this thing. I could sit and work for like six to 12 hours and just have snacks and just work, work, work, work, work and get a whole lot done. And I still do that, but I don't push myself as hard. Like, I get sleep now.

Tim Fulton 24:56Yeah, that's good. And so was there a goal — you have the goal for the completion — was there a goal of, I want to create a body of work that can go into a gallery?

Lisa Mclymont 25:10My first jump was, I would like to create a body of work. When I kept doing my own portfolio website, I didn't feel like I had enough to hang anything on. So I had pieces and parts of things. Like, this was a good piece, that was a good piece, but nothing felt cohesive. The colors were looking kind of cohesive, because I'd locked in early on what kind of colors I wanted to use. And ultimately, the queer me, I use a lot of the rainbow. I'll use this spectrum of color, but I have meanings for why I use different colors, and I might mix up how they are, so they're not showing in rainbow form. But color is mood, color is education, and color helps create the story for me. So I was achieving all of that with that first body of work. And then I was able to put a big chunk — make a page, that's the Universe Tribe. I had a title for this body of work, and I called it "ongoing," because I don't know if I'll hit this again, so I can always add to it.

Tim Fulton 26:10Yeah, add another three.

Lisa Mclymont 26:13Right. And it goes on. But the start of that was, you know, a lot of hope on it, and hope that it got some attention, hope that I did all these things. And I showed it in a couple places, and it really took hold. Because at that point, I was still getting requests for the jewelry and doing tables, and it wasn't giving me the income that I was looking for. Doing a table at a market and then walking away with, like, $1,000 if you're lucky, usually $250 that covers the cost of buying that table space — it wasn't enough anymore. I really need to lock into something that I can call myself an artist for. A working artist, an artist that hopes to make a living on it. So I think I hit that in 2017. I was invited to a show at the Faculty Club, and that's where Rebecca Ibel came to my show. And she was key in getting me into Art for Life, which is a big auction, the oldest running, the longest-running auction for art that supports the LGBTQ community, specifically the HIV/AIDS community. And then from there, it's just been building on a thing. But the getting started is really worth recognizing and thinking about a lot. So I appreciate this now.

Tim Fulton 27:36And so are you represented?

Lisa Mclymont 28:00Yes. She represents me.

Tim Fulton 27:36Talk a little bit, for those that aren't familiar, just about how that works. I think most people are familiar with how an agent represents an actor — they get their auditions, and they help negotiate the contract. How does that work with visual art?

Lisa Mclymont 28:00Well, I was completely unfamiliar with that, so I'm still navigating that world of representation. I do know that it's jumped my pricing quite a bit, and it took me out of a market that I was used to, so I'm still navigating that. But working with her, I also have access to other artists to talk about process, chances to show out of Columbus, negotiating with someone on where to go from here, which is kind of exciting. I've had some really great conversations with her about what I'd like. And then she recommends who I should look at — not necessarily process-wise what to look at, but more people to meet and where I could show up next to show my art. So roughly learning as I go.

Tim Fulton 28:51Yeah. How do you think about your art now? Is it, like, okay, this is my job? Are you at a point — and maybe this is not a point that people have to get to — where you're like, okay, I've got to create this many works, or this scale of works, over this predetermined amount of time?

Lisa Mclymont 29:15Ooh, that is a deep question. Mostly because I have interests and I work in multiple areas. So for the fine art aspect, I definitely want to create another chunk of work to have Rebecca be able to sell. But also, because of the protests, I had started doing murals and doing talks with groups about Black lives mattering and that kind of thing. So there is also the maintaining of a presence within the social justice sphere as an artist — making my work speak up for not just me, but my community, my gay community, my Black community, my women community. I think a lot about all of that and what that means as I embark on any piece. So if I can have a mural showcase a hero and be put in an area where it educates people, that hits a lot of buttons and makes it more likely that I'll want to participate in creating that mural. Because I've been invited to do murals that just want my body in the presence painting live. And while that can be cool, that's not really what I need to be about. So I have to keep focused on the core thing. And maybe I have to say no to that, so I can sit in the studio and start on my body of work, or keep working on a body of work.

Tim Fulton 30:49And so, back to the representation part of it, does she have an expectation of you, of, you're going to generate this amount of work ahead of this show? Is that how that timeline works?

Lisa Mclymont 31:07I think in the end, that's where we're going. I think she called me so early that I am still trying to figure that out. I would like to get to the point where every year she gets three to six works that are different sizes, hopefully larger. I'm pushing myself to work larger, and that's been hard for me, but that is something I'm working on, to populate that work. I don't have a number of other work I do, because I'll still do some design work. I'm really just hustling to make sure I keep my financial bases covered. At the end of the day, I have to make sure I have enough money for my health care and all that stuff. So I've been taking on these works, and then trying to hold on to the desire to keep my art up here, present. So I'm feeling the stress of that. It's the new year — well, technically not the new year anymore, we're in March now. I need to get things going.

Tim Fulton 32:08All of Q1, and then we get all our work done in Q2 and Q3.

Lisa Mclymont 32:16Exactly. Holidays start then. Spring is usually the downtime, but I have that burning, like, oh, I gotta do some things. So the second I start — getting the first piece, the first portrait, the last touches on it — I'm gonna feel really good. But until then, I'm still in, like, marinating mode and production mode.

Tim Fulton 32:36Some people call it seasonal affective disorder.

Lisa Mclymont 32:40There is a lot of that going on, for sure. I'm in Ohio. That's what we do.

Tim Fulton 32:47Can you talk a little bit more about your mural work? What that was inspired by, and the actual — because you do some commercial and some art?

Lisa Mclymont 32:56Yep, it is a mix. And I really got started because I was working at CAPA. I'm not there anymore, but at the time that the pandemic hit, I was — let's see, I started in November, and we left the year before. So about four months I was on the job, and the pandemic hit, and everybody was remote. So I was lucky to have the job for that time. But by that May, there was so much unrest between the police and what was happening nationwide. I was crying on the couch again, sitting there like, oh my god, is this my life now? I was actually in this space, in the seat that I'm sitting in right now. But I got the call after the big protest broke out, and the windows of the Ohio Theatre were broken and they had been wooded up. CAPA reached out and asked if I would be interested, because they knew I was an artist too, if I'd be interested in painting a mural. And I said I would definitely be interested. But at that point, I had never done murals, let alone really any live painting, because it felt really performative, and I'm not a performer in that sense. So I reached out to Adam, who brought in Jen Bluesky, and Jen's partner Andy, and the four of us came together and created that mural. And that was really the thing that hinged on — all of a sudden, all these murals popped up downtown and so forth. So it's kind of really great to be a part of that history. But the bottom line is, we were all there as artists to speak up for the rights of other human beings, and not just to put nice art out there.

Tim Fulton 34:42That's the Bluesky family you are referencing, right?

Lisa Mclymont 34:45Oh yes, I said Jen. I'm sorry. Jen Bluesky. All three of them are the Bluesky family. But right at the pandemic, me and my partner, Kat, shared it in — we moved out of Franklinton so we wouldn't have to pay as much rent, because we were both working full-time. And Blockfort needs a presence of artists that work there during the day and whatnot. So anyway, we had moved out. That was one of the projects we got to work on, and we got to see each other and be together for a little bit. And it was really encouraging being downtown. There were swirls of people circling the Statehouse — they'd walk the block, and every few minutes I'd see them again while we were painting, and we'd cheer them on and they'd cheer us on. And in that sense, it was a really great experience. And then nighttime hit, and it was, like, free-for-all again, while I went home. So I didn't find myself downtown. I'm old, I didn't want to do that. So I found a different way to support and a different way to raise protest, and I just stuck with that. And from there, I started getting calls for work on my own. My initial first mural was at Veritas — a quote on Gwendolyn Brooks. I look back to when I was born, late '60s, all the people that left us really great information that we could use today. So I took quotes that basically said "Black lives matter" without saying that, because at that point it was really becoming just a catchphrase instead of what it was meant to be, which is the true statement. It was very politicized. So I found ways to keep that conversation going by looking at it from different facets. And I think that is the core of all of my work at this point. I still do that. I think me, as a Black gay woman, coming to the table, being invited to a table to speak on it, or talk to a group that is probably mostly white, or at least show the community that we are trying to work together to push for some change — that makes everybody feel good, number one. And hopefully I push enough buttons that they think about something and make a change, and it's not just decorative. Because art at the end of the day can end up being just decorative. I'm always very watchful of, like, where that energy goes, and how to police it. It's a full-time job. It is a job. It's a physical job. But I still love the idea of painting letters. I've gotten a little more painterly in my approach, like my mural that I did at the end of 2020 was Rambling House, and then I got to finish it early last year.

Tim Fulton 37:54I was gonna say that was last year, because I drove by and I —

Lisa Mclymont 37:57I started it and then — it was right before winter hit. And then I did a first phase just to get it up there and get people excited. And then I went back and got to put all the instruments in and actually finish it. And then right after that, I got to do Spock in Clintonville. So if you see "Live Long and Prosper" across from Lucky's Market, right next door to Giant Eagle, that was me. And I got to do my Trek self. So Spock's head and hand are five feet tall. So weird.

Tim Fulton 38:28So with that — I'm sure they all happen differently.

Lisa Mclymont 38:34It usually is, like, oh, I heard you do this thing, I really would like you to do something on our wall. And then —

Tim Fulton 38:39Do you have to submit it to them, like, here's what I'm planning, is this okay?

Lisa Mclymont 38:44Yep. So I propose a couple of designs. With the Spock one, we originally were going to do something based on the brand — repair, recycle, renew, or something like that. I tried all these things, and then I slept on it, because I wasn't happy. And I woke up and I was like, yeah, Clintonville needs Spock. So I proposed it, and they went for it. And I knew they would, because they fix computers, and it fit perfectly. I think it's a well-loved thing. So I absolutely agree with that. I was able to paint it in a week, too. So it was about a week and a half of planning and approvals and sketches and all that stuff, and then I got it all done in a week, with a friend who let me borrow their platform lift, their scaffolding. He'd heave the scaffolding up and down the wall, and I got it all done in a week. So I feel pretty proud of that. And it was, like, the hottest week of September, too.

Tim Fulton 39:49And, pivoting just a little bit, you also sit on the Columbus Public Art Commission.

Lisa Mclymont 39:57I do. I'm all over the place.

Tim Fulton 40:00Let's talk about what philosophy you're bringing to that.

Lisa Mclymont 40:04So what's really great with that is, number one, I was nominated by Mary Gray, who used to run Rife Gallery. She's amazing. She's still on the commission. I'm not sure she'll renew another cycle — I think she's already gone through a couple. But I was really proud to be invited. And I was really interested in learning more about what it takes to bring art to the city, what that process is like, how does it happen. It seems like such a closed-network thing. So being on the board helps me see it. And where I can, I try to share some insight and talk about that. So when I get to jury a show, or when I'm proposing art — when I'm proposing murals, I mean street murals — I have a better idea of what's happening at the higher level in the city. And not that all the street murals get funded by the city, because they don't. And that's where things get a little, like, overlap. So I might be approving a mural, like at Crew Stadium, and I go down the street and I paint something down a little alley on a small business wall. It's been really fascinating to learn a little bit deeper about the process of how art informs our city. So the Public Art Commission has been really great. It's a good, thoughtful, empathetic group of people who come from all ranges. I'm one of the few working artists, but there's lots of other business people and arts administrators that volunteer their time to guide what's happening.

Tim Fulton 41:54And is it that the city has a certain amount of funding set aside for public art?

Lisa Mclymont 42:02Okay, but realistically, there has been no money, with the pandemic and all these other things happening. We haven't really been able to recommend any spending of any sort. It's a freeze right now. So we're pretty much in a holding pattern, trying to figure things out, as we have been tasked with taking down the Christopher Columbus statue and changing the city seal and the flag, and what all that looks like, without a budget.

Tim Fulton 42:33Not to correct you, but you do mean the city seal?

Lisa Mclymont 42:36City seal. Sorry. Yes. City seal. Because I think Christopher Columbus was in the seal.

Tim Fulton 42:44The boat.

Lisa Mclymont 42:47That's right. The Santa Maria. That's right.

Tim Fulton 42:50You can see it on the side of every policeman's jacket.

Lisa Mclymont 42:54Yeah. I learned that a police officer, or someone in the police force, designed that. Oh, I didn't know that. I just only recently learned that. But I haven't dipped into the history of it and done a whole lot yet, because we have to put a request for proposal out to find vendors to do this work. So I'm trying to hold off on going in depth with my designer brain on it, because that's not really what my job is supposed to be. Well, I personally would love to know, but I'm hesitant, because I'm busy doing these other things. So I'm really trying not to put a ton of time into that right now.

Tim Fulton 43:38And so that RFP is different from what's going to happen with the statue.

Lisa Mclymont 43:44Very different. It's a whole different community. So the statue committee has met. Two — sorry, three — other commission members were on that committee, with representatives from the Italian community, as well as a Native American community, to discuss how to move forward from here. So this whole last year has been a really in-depth, sometimes traumatic experience for everybody. But it's exciting to hear the conversations that are happening around this. I wish that there was a way to let the rest of the public know, because it just kind of went away, and to them it's like nothing's happening. But there's not really a great time to talk about it, because there's no advancement yet. This is just conversations happening that need to happen to see where we go from here. So not even resolutions yet either. So it's been interesting.

Tim Fulton 44:46No, it's a super interesting process. The word that comes to mind is sort of the disavowing that's happening. You and I have been here and are old enough to remember that our visitors bureau was called Discover Columbus, and there was a boat, and it was — we were not only named Columbus, we were very proud of the namesake of it.

Lisa Mclymont 45:12Which, to a lot of people, was a lot better than Cowtown. So we got away from Cowtown.

Tim Fulton 45:20It's a needed change, and I'm glad to hear that it's happening. I want to wrap up just by — I ask the same question of everybody. What do you think Columbus does well? And you can take this outside of your art sphere if you want. And what does Columbus maybe not do so well?

Lisa Mclymont 45:44Oh, I could do the "not so well" easily for you, so I'll start there. I will say that Columbus is a blue oasis in Ohio. I think that there is a lot of diversity, thanks to our colleges, a lot of industry and drive. I love all of that. I think where Columbus does not do well — the largest is public transit. Transit in general. I mean, we have the CoGo bikes, but biking in general isn't in a great situation. I think more attention needs to be made there. Penalizing hybrid car owners such as myself, who is a working artist and not a rich person — paying an extra $100 to register my tags and get a sticker to put on my car every year is outrageous, and it makes me angry. I think that there's work to do there, especially with all this talk of electric cars hitting the place. Electric cars have $200 every year, in addition, on their registration tag, because we don't go and buy enough gas. But I bought the car because I didn't want to buy gas. So I feel like there's a different way to approach that. Because the claim is you're not putting enough money into paying for the road repair, and that seems loose to me. Because why not just hike up the gas, so that balance is there, and then everybody pays a little bit extra on the tags, because we're all using cars on the roads? But whatever. And supporting COTA in a better way, like — treating COTA like this weird, wicked stepchild, and then scolding them for not being able to do the service they want to do. They've been doing it for decades. I think that's a fail. It's not just on COTA to be better. It's really on how Columbus handles public transit. The metro rail that people keep talking about, that's never gonna happen, from the sound of it, unless a Republican governor comes in or something. I really don't know what's going to happen.

Tim Fulton 47:54None of us do know.

Lisa Mclymont 47:57Yeah. So, oh well. There's a bunch of other things, but I think that right there, mobility, is a big one. If there were ways to make it so people wanted to travel more together in a system that was a healthy system, that was a good fare, there'd be more people, and we wouldn't be holding on to our cars as much, there wouldn't be as much wear and tear on the roads, and blah, blah, blah. Yeah, I should stop there.

Tim Fulton 48:29No, that's good. Lisa, thank you so much for your time today.

Lisa Mclymont 48:34Yes, thank you. We covered a lot of bases.

Tim Fulton 48:45Thank you for listening to the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. Again, to get more information on what we discussed today, see the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Please rate, subscribe, and share this episode of the Confluence Cast with your friends, family, contacts, enemies, your favorite artist. If you're interested in sponsoring the Confluence Cast, get in touch with us. We can be reached by email at info@theconfluencecast.com. Our theme music was composed by Benji Robinson. Our producer is Philip Cogley. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. Have a great week.