Irvine for Ohio

Tim Fulton 0:09Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Confluence Cast presented by Columbus Underground. We are a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. This week, I sat down with Travis Irvine, Ohio's libertarian gubernatorial candidate, for a live interview at the Columbus Podcast Festival. We talked about his rich and varied history running for political office, made fun of John Kasich, and his upcoming feature film, Killer Raccoons 2. You can get more information on what we discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Also, the Confluence Cast is on Patreon. Find out how to support this podcast on our website, theconfluencecast.com, or at patreon.com/confluence. The Confluence Cast is sponsored by Little Rock Bar. Little Rock Bar is located at 944 North Fourth Street in Italian Village. With 30 beers on tap, Little Rock Bar has happy hour from 4:00 to 7:00 PM every day. Every Tuesday, get $3 draft beers all night while you enjoy Rock Your Cock Off karaoke. Wednesdays is Everybody's a Comedian, hosted by Travis Haywicher. It's like trivia, but you prove your snark instead of smarts. Info, hours, and upcoming events at littlerockbar.net. Everyone's night should have a little rock. Enjoy the interview.

Event Announcer 1:43Welcome to Columbus Podcast Festival, presented by Kaufman Development, where high design and a sense of belonging come together for a truly special place to live. Up next, we have the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. It's a weekly Columbus-centric podcast focusing on the civics, lifestyle, entertainment, and people of our city, hosted by our very own Tim Fulton. Please give it up for the Confluence Cast. Woo!

Tim Fulton 2:16This is my theme song.

Travis Irvine 2:17I like your theme song.

Tim Fulton 2:19Thank you. Uh, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Confluence Cast. Big thank you to Katie and all the organizing crew for, from the Columbus Podcast Festival for having us out. I'm sitting down here with comedian, journalist, filmmaker, sometimes politician, Travis Irvine. How are you, Travis?

Travis Irvine 2:38Hello, Tim. It's good to see you again.

Tim Fulton 2:40It's good to see you as well. Listeners to this podcast will recall that Travis and I have sat down in the past to sort of talk about our interconnections in the past. We've known each other since we were in our-

Travis Irvine 2:51Teenagers

Tim Fulton 2:52... early teens.

Travis Irvine 2:53Early teens? Late teens.

Tim Fulton 2:54Late teens.

Travis Irvine 2:54You with a car, I remember.

Tim Fulton 2:56Oh.

Travis Irvine 2:56And I thought you were very cool.

Tim Fulton 2:58Well, there you go.

Travis Irvine 2:59Yeah.

Tim Fulton 2:59So yes, that was certainly late teens. We did a summer touring production of Robin Hood-

Travis Irvine 3:04That's right

Tim Fulton 3:05... throughout the city of Columbus. I, you were-

Travis Irvine 3:08I was Prince John.

Tim Fulton 3:09Prince John.

Travis Irvine 3:10You were Robin Hood.

Tim Fulton 3:11I was Robin Hood.

Travis Irvine 3:12Uh, you kicked my ass at some point, I think.

Tim Fulton 3:14Yeah, I think we, uh-

Travis Irvine 3:15We had a fake sword fight

Tim Fulton 3:16... there, there was a, some amount of stagecraft with bows.

Travis Irvine 3:19Yeah.

Tim Fulton 3:19Uh, which bows, for-

Travis Irvine 3:21I'm usually not allowed

Tim Fulton 3:22... those that aren't aware, is just a large stick.

Travis Irvine 3:24Yeah. Yes, right.

Tim Fulton 3:24Yes. Absolutely.

Travis Irvine 3:26And then the other Prince John in that play, who went on to do other things, is a guy named John Schwarz, who produces the Star Wars movies now.

Tim Fulton 3:34What?

Travis Irvine 3:34Did you know? Yeah, uh, Jazz Hands John Schwarz?

Tim Fulton 3:37Yeah.

Travis Irvine 3:38Yeah. He's, uh, he works for Kathleen Kennedy, and then Steven Spielberg, and now he's producing all the Star Wars movies.

Tim Fulton 3:45And what happened to us?

Travis Irvine 3:46That's what I'm saying.

Tim Fulton 3:48All right.

Travis Irvine 3:48Schwarz wins again.

Tim Fulton 3:49So, uh-

Travis Irvine 3:50The Schwartz is strong with him.

Tim Fulton 3:52All right. Y- you are recently back in Columbus. You just wrapped filming and are currently still editing, correct?

Travis Irvine 4:00Yes.

Tim Fulton 4:00Uh-

Travis Irvine 4:00We are in post-production

Tim Fulton 4:02... for the follow-up to the film Killer Raccoons, the new film Killer Raccoons 2: Dark Christmas in the Dark.

Travis Irvine 4:11It's actually Killer Raccoons! 2! Dark Christmas in the Dark.

Tim Fulton 4:17There is no colon.

Travis Irvine 4:18No colons.

Tim Fulton 4:19I apologize.

Travis Irvine 4:20No. My producers are terrified of colonoscopies, so.

Tim Fulton 4:23Can you tell us about that film?

Travis Irvine 4:25Yeah, absolutely. Basically, in the first movie we made when I was at college at Ohio University, and it was a, you know, very simple concept, killer raccoons. And they attack a campground full of, uh, college kids, and hilarity ensues. And, um, so, uh, for years we've talked about making a sequel. We, we ended up being the first undergraduate movie to get distribution, which we got through Troma Entertainment.

Tim Fulton 4:49Right.

Travis Irvine 4:49Which we got no money for, and we got-

Tim Fulton 4:51Troma, best known for-

Travis Irvine 4:52Toxic Avenger

Tim Fulton 4:53... Toxic Avenger.

Travis Irvine 4:53Which I know they're having the musical here at some point.

Tim Fulton 4:56Yes, here at The Short North Stage, they'll have the Toxic Avenger next season.

Travis Irvine 4:59Yeah.

Tim Fulton 5:00Yeah.

Travis Irvine 5:00Oh, love it. So they picked up the first movie, and it's kinda like a little cult movie. You know, eventually I think they just put it on their YouTube channel. But for years we've talked about doing a sequel, and it was just gonna be the plot of Under Siege 2, but with raccoons.

Tim Fulton 5:13And that is truly what you've done.

Travis Irvine 5:15That is literally what I did. Uh, when it came time to write the script, I just watched Under Siege 2 and would pause it, and then rewrite the scene with raccoons, and then hit play again. And I don't know if this is legal, but I'm gonna argue parody. So.

Tim Fulton 5:29Yeah, absolutely. Well, it's, so if you watch the trailer for the film, which we'll cut in sort of splices of-

Travis Irvine 5:35We did bring one.

Tim Fulton 5:37We did bring it. We, the audio w- just wasn't working properly, but please do check out the trailer, and we'll cut in splices when we edit this. But at the end of the trailer, so it's all based on a train. That's what happens.

Travis Irvine 5:50Yeah, if anyone here is unfamiliar with the movie Under Siege 2-

Tim Fulton 5:54Please give us the rundown

Travis Irvine 5:55... I have seen it 500 times. It gets worse each time. It is so bad. I first saw Under Siege 2 when I was 12, and I had no context for the first Under Siege. I didn't know. And I remember we were in a van with the Borkin family down to North Carolina for summer vacation.

Tim Fulton 6:09Uh-huh.

Travis Irvine 6:09And they throw in Under Siege 2, and it It scared me, but then I also could tell it was a terrible movie. So I always remembered in my brain that Under Siege 2 was terrible, so-

Tim Fulton 6:19Eight-year-old, eight-year-old Travis Irvine was like, "I must file this away and 30 years later"-

Travis Irvine 6:23Yeah, file it for later. Exactly.

Tim Fulton 6:25Right.

Travis Irvine 6:25Yeah, you might need to make fun of this 30 years later. So yeah, it was a no-brainer for us that we, we wanted to make this movie. But one thing we did do that I am glad we did, we pulled in other bad action sequel plots as well. So Die Hard 2, which most people regard as the worst Die Hard until recently.

Tim Fulton 6:42Until modern times.

Travis Irvine 6:43Until modern Die Hards.

Tim Fulton 6:44Right.

Travis Irvine 6:46Um, basically people, uh, you know, the suggestion was if, if we bring in Die Hard 2, then it becomes a Christmas movie. And on the train, we use this train in Nelsonville, the, the Hocking Valley Scenic Railway. Nonprofit, great train, super fun, and they do summer rides, and they do Christmas rides, and that's kinda their big thing. And we were thinking about doing a summer movie, but then we were like, "Hey, wait a minute. You throw in some Die ... sprinkle in some Die Hard 2." And then, uh, you've got, uh, Die Hard 2, Under Siege 2 with raccoons.

Tim Fulton 7:15And for those that don't remember Die Hard 2, Die Hard 2 is the one based at the airport, right?

Travis Irvine 7:19Yes.

Tim Fulton 7:20Right.

Travis Irvine 7:20That's the, the other fascinating thing about Under Siege 2 and Die Hard 2, they're both, uh, the plots-

Tim Fulton 7:24Transit

Travis Irvine 7:25... yes, both transit, and then we also threw in a little Speed 2, which is on a boat. So you got them all mixed together. And but the nice thing is about all three of these movies is someone in the '90s in Hollywood was just like, "Computer villains are hot right now." So all three of the villains are just using computers to hijack transit. So they hijack the train, and then they hijack a satellite. They hijack the airport, the Dulles Airport in Die Hard 2, and then a speedboat, or, uh, you know, or a cruise ship in, uh, Speed 2. So your bad guys are usually just close-up of their face, and they're making a creepy face, and then they cut to these terrible '90s graphics, which is just literally like, "Boat goes faster."

Tim Fulton 8:02Bridge falls down.

Travis Irvine 8:04Yeah. Yeah, yeah. At one point ... Oh, sorry. This is-

Tim Fulton 8:07Please

Travis Irvine 8:07... this is the last bit of nerdy note I'll do on Under Siege 2. But on the first thing that Eric Bogosian, famed New York monologist Eric Bogosian, as your chief bad guy in Under Siege 2, he-

Tim Fulton 8:18Right

Travis Irvine 8:18... he uses the, uh, satellite that he hijacks from the train to blow up a weapons facility in China, and they literally just dissolve to, like, a building on fire and then dissolve back. Eric Bogosian's just like, "What? You just blew up a part of the world."

Tim Fulton 8:33I did it. And then-

Travis Irvine 8:34And then-

Tim Fulton 8:34Yeah, they had run out of money at that point in post, and so-

Travis Irvine 8:36Yeah, at some point someone was like, "Eh, this will work."

Tim Fulton 8:38Right. Uh, since you've last been on the podcast, you were still living in New York at the time. You've been doing a lot of work for Vice.

Travis Irvine 8:46Yeah, yeah.

Tim Fulton 8:47What, who e- whom else have you been writing for/doing video production for?

Travis Irvine 8:52The nice thing is being back here, I've been writing for Columbus Free Press.

Tim Fulton 8:55Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 8:56I saw a stack of copies out there. Be sure to grab one. And then, uh, I've been writing for columbusunderground.com. I don't know if you've heard of it.

Tim Fulton 9:03Yeah, they are in fact the presenter of this podcast.

Travis Irvine 9:05Oh, what? I had no idea.

Tim Fulton 9:06Indeed.

Travis Irvine 9:07That's great. That's so crazy how that worked out.

Tim Fulton 9:07It's the Condolence Cast presented by Columbus Underground.

Travis Irvine 9:09Oh, that's such a long name. I like it.

Tim Fulton 9:12You also almost immediately when you moved back released a comedy album.

Travis Irvine 9:17Yes. Oh my God. It's funny you mention that. You know, journalism school, they taught me always bring props to podcasts and radio shows. This is, uh, this is the album. This is called Guy From Ohio. It was recorded at the lovely Mad Lab Theatre.

Tim Fulton 9:29Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 9:30You spell it with an R-E, not E-R. And I'm really happy with how it turned out. It's, uh, produced by, uh, On Tour Records out of Kentucky. They do a lot of, like, regional guys. Stuart Huff is a comedian. He was kinda the inspiration for the Illiberal Rednecks. So, uh, I'm on the same label with him, and I'm really, really happy with it. Yeah, it came out June 30th. We did the big party.

Tim Fulton 9:48We did the big party at Little Rock.

Travis Irvine 9:50At Little Rock.

Tim Fulton 9:50Yes.

Travis Irvine 9:50And you ...

Tim Fulton 9:51So-

Travis Irvine 9:51Some interesting promo

Tim Fulton 9:53... indeed.

Travis Irvine 9:53Yeah.

Tim Fulton 9:53So I do marketing for this bar in Columbus called Little Rock Bar, and Travis came and did his launch event for the album there. And I was monitoring social media and got a notification on Facebook that someone had shared the event, and I clicked through, and it said, "Roger Stone has shared your event." And I said, "That can't possibly be the Roger Stone that I'm thinking of that basically created lobbying as we currently know it."

Travis Irvine 10:23Yeah.

Tim Fulton 10:23"Is a, a confidant of our current president, Donald Trump." And so I immediately texted you, and I said, "Is this a joke?" And your response was, I don't know if you recall-

Travis Irvine 10:34No

Tim Fulton 10:35... your response was, "No, I consider Roger a mentor."

Travis Irvine 10:40Oh, yeah, yeah.

Tim Fulton 10:41Tell me-

Travis Irvine 10:41And it was that Roger Stone.

Tim Fulton 10:43Yes. Yeah.

Travis Irvine 10:44It li- it is the Roger Stone.

Tim Fulton 10:44You, sorry, you did verify that. How do you know Roger Stone?

Travis Irvine 10:47I worked for Roger Stone briefly during 2012 Libertarian Gary Johnson's campaign.

Tim Fulton 10:54Okay.

Travis Irvine 10:54Roger Stone was an unofficial advisor to Gary Johnson 'cause he was sick of the Republican Party. And some way or another, 'cause I'm involved with the Libertarian Party in Ohio, I got hired on through one of Roger's guys who's my age. And sure enough, Roger came to a comedy show. It was the first time I met Roger Stone was he came to one of my shows, and I killed, of course.

Tim Fulton 11:14Okay.

Travis Irvine 11:14I did kill. Killed that show. And then, uh, we got invited to his roof in his Manhattan apartment for the after-party. And I, and he, he was just kept trying to talk-

Tim Fulton 11:22Sorry. Roger Stone threw you an after-party is what you're saying?

Travis Irvine 11:25No, no. They were having an after-party anyway.

Tim Fulton 11:26Okay.

Travis Irvine 11:26No one ever throws me a party. Come on.

Tim Fulton 11:28Okay.

Travis Irvine 11:28Just over a hilarious set? No way. And Roger Stone is, and he's, you know, he's an older guy, and he was trying to, like, be funny 'cause he just saw, seen me be funny, and he was just, like, bothering me. I was like, "Who the hell is this old guy? He is just not funny."

Tim Fulton 11:40Are you being honest? He didn't know who he was.

Travis Irvine 11:42I, I had no idea who Roger Stone was.

Tim Fulton 11:43Okay.

Travis Irvine 11:43I don't think a lot of people knew until this documentary came out last year.

Tim Fulton 11:47So this was-

Travis Irvine 11:47The, the Get Me Roger Stone documentary

Tim Fulton 11:48... to be absolutely clear, this was before the documentary came out.

Travis Irvine 11:51Oh, yeah.

Tim Fulton 11:52Like, I knew-

Travis Irvine 11:52This was 2012

Tim Fulton 11:53... right.

Travis Irvine 11:53I mean, this was before ... I mean, I guess Roger's always worked close with Trump, but it was definitely before he created Trump as a political candidate.

Tim Fulton 12:03I first became aware of Roger Stone with studying Watergate.

Travis Irvine 12:07Never heard of it.

Tim Fulton 12:09And then also was aware of him sort of starting Lobbying as we currently know it. This was before, for me, before the Netflix-

Travis Irvine 12:17Yeah

Tim Fulton 12:18... documentary came out.

Travis Irvine 12:19You, you were more educated than I, because I gradually learned who Roger was as, as I was working for him.

Tim Fulton 12:24After you physically met him.

Travis Irvine 12:25Yeah, yeah.

Tim Fulton 12:26Okay.

Travis Irvine 12:27And I was-

Tim Fulton 12:27And nothing gave you pause?

Travis Irvine 12:29Well, no, because we were working for the, the Libertarians. Uh, we were working for Gary Johnson's campaign, so I literally only knew him from that context.

Tim Fulton 12:36Okay.

Travis Irvine 12:37And I knew him, you know, I would do videos, I would write communication stuff. I would, uh, go emcee the rallies. I would get... You know, you get a room pumped up for a guy like Gary Johnson, you can really get a room pumped up, let me tell you. Just a bunch of awkward Libertarians in bow ties, you know? But they're the best, they're the best. And Gare Bear is such a sweetheart, by the way. I know he got a tough rap after 2016, but he just reminds me of, like, a suburb dad who, like, was successful and then he, he goes and runs triathlons and, and then runs for president.

Tim Fulton 13:05Well, and I totally believe that he had the best of intentions.

Travis Irvine 13:09Yes.

Tim Fulton 13:10I wanna move on to talk about sort of, so you're, you've been involved in Libertarian politics for over 10 years at this point.

Travis Irvine 13:17Yeah.

Tim Fulton 13:18Part of the reason you're back is both the new Killer Coons movie-

Travis Irvine 13:22Yes

Tim Fulton 13:22... but then also the upcoming gubernatorial election as well.

Travis Irvine 13:27That is correct, yes.

Tim Fulton 13:28Tell us what sort of the state af- state of affairs are with the Libertarian Party in the state of Ohio as it relates to statewide races.

Travis Irvine 13:37Sure. So in 2013, the Republicans in the super majority in the state legislature passed a bill called SB 193, which was a ballot access bill designed to control minor political parties, basically. For years and years, the secretary of state, usually a Republican, would try to make new rules to make it harder for minor political parties to get on the ballot.

Tim Fulton 13:58Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 13:58Libertarian Party, and the Green Party, and the ACLU would always come in and sue in some context and win because secretary of state cannot make ballot access laws. They are not a legislative body.

Tim Fulton 14:09Right.

Travis Irvine 14:09So 2013, Republican legislature was like, "All right, we gotta take care of this the right way," and they ran this bill through the Senate and, and went to Kasich's desk, like, that day. It was very, very nuts. And what it does is it makes it harder for minor political parties to get on the ballot in such that if there's a statewide election, presidential or gubernatorial, a minor political party needs to get 3% of the vote, popular vote, in the state to become a registered, recognized minor political party in the state for four more years, and then you have ballot access for four more years.

Tim Fulton 14:40And so basically what the bill did was said, "Okay, next election, here's where the baseline starts."

Travis Irvine 14:45Yeah, and they did that in 2013 and to get it ready for 2014.

Tim Fulton 14:48Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 14:49Um, now of course, again, ACLU, Green Party, Libertarian Party, they all sued, and actually won that it was too close to the election, so SB 193 did not go into effect until after, uh, the 2014 election. But if a political party fails to get 3% of the vote in the presidential or, or gubernatorial, then they need to go through an arduous signature gathering process. I've actually brought my petition right here. They need to get 1% of the total votes cast in the previous statewide election. So I believe, I'm doing the math in my head, but I'm guessing about 5 million people voted, uh, in 2016, so we have to get 54,000 signatures to become a political party again because we did not get 3% in the 2014 gubernatorial election because our Libertarian candidate was kicked off the ballot by the Republicans on a completely different technicality. So someone, maybe John Kasich- ... really didn't want the Libertarians on the ballot at all.

Tim Fulton 15:47Because it was a threat.

Travis Irvine 15:48I believe they thought that our gubernatorial candidate, Charlie Earl, in 2014, who used to be a state rep, he's a big firebrand with the Tea Party people. And, you know, even if you don't agree with Libertarian politics or, or Tea Party poli- that is completely fine, but Kasich's guys were terrified that he would suck votes away from Kasich. And they all knew in the back of their minds, "Hey, we gotta have a big old margin of victory here so John can go run for president."

Tim Fulton 16:13Right.

Travis Irvine 16:13You know, if you recall, they also did their dirty work on the Democrat candidate that year, Ed Fitzgerald, who, uh, well, they got him on all kinds of stuff. No driver's license, cheating on his wife while driving. I mean, good grief. It was just-

Tim Fulton 16:24Well, and it was, w- when we did our pre-interview for this, it was a lot of, I similarly pointed out, like, it is n- nothing that they pinned to him was something that could've been discovered in vetting.

Travis Irvine 16:35Right.

Tim Fulton 16:35It was all sort of little stuff, but depending on how you frame it, it's like, well, what the fuck was that guy doing?

Travis Irvine 16:41Yeah. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, why wouldn't you have a driver's license? I mean, let's-

Tim Fulton 16:44Right

Travis Irvine 16:44... especially you're a Libertarian, and, you know, "Government can't tell me to drive, man," right?

Tim Fulton 16:50So what is your current involvement with the Libertarian Party?

Travis Irvine 16:54Sure. So that was all 2013, 2014. Charlie Earl got kicked off the ballot. Um, a lot of Libertarians voted for the Green Party candidate.

Tim Fulton 17:01It should be noted, yeah, the Green Party candidate is-

Travis Irvine 17:03She got 3%, and she's in

Tim Fulton 17:05... she's in.

Travis Irvine 17:05Yeah.

Tim Fulton 17:05Automatically.

Travis Irvine 17:06Yeah, so Green Party has ballot access until this year. Now they gotta get to 3% again, though-

Tim Fulton 17:10Mm-hmm

Travis Irvine 17:10... and this is what's so stupid about SB 193 and, and just blatantly unfair, is that if they don't get 3%, then they gotta do everything that the Libertarians are trying to do now. So I am involved in that I am gathering signatures, A, but then I've also been tapped to be the gubernatorial candidate myself this year and try to get to 3%. And the only reason they did that is 'cause I've run for office before, ran for mayor of Bexley in 2007, got 5%, and ran for US Congress with the Libertarians in 2010, and I got 4%. So I'm just keep going down, and I hope I can get them their 3%. That's the goal here.

Tim Fulton 17:46So again, there's, for those that aren't aware and haven't listened to previous episode with Travis, you've run for mayor of Bexley before.

Travis Irvine 17:53Yes.

Tim Fulton 17:54Run, run for Congress. There is actually a film, American Mayor, that you can check out on Amazon Prime.

Travis Irvine 18:00Yeah, absolutely.

Tim Fulton 18:01Please do.

Travis Irvine 18:02I get two cents every time someone just watches it, and if you leave it on loop all day, I think I get five cents.

Tim Fulton 18:09You figured this math out?

Travis Irvine 18:10No, I don't.

Tim Fulton 18:11Okay, you get-

Travis Irvine 18:11We get, like, a check for, like, $2 every

Tim Fulton 18:13It's nice

Travis Irvine 18:14... a few months. I know, it is nice. You're right.

Tim Fulton 18:15Yeah. It's like, that's an ice cream cone.

Travis Irvine 18:18Yeah.

Tim Fulton 18:18So at this point, there are two barriers of entry for you being on the ballot, right?

Travis Irvine 18:22Yes.

Tim Fulton 18:22There's one-

Travis Irvine 18:24The signatures. It's 54,000.

Tim Fulton 18:2654,000 signatures.

Travis Irvine 18:27Yes. May-

Tim Fulton 18:28And they have to be 54,000 valid signatures.

Travis Irvine 18:30Valid signatures, yeah.

Tim Fulton 18:31So the, what's the goal to, at like, what do you actually think you guys need to get to in order to-

Travis Irvine 18:37Oh, well, fortunately, I mean, the Libertarian Party, both the national and the, the Ohio State Party, are completely on this because this is very important. I mean, the Libertarians-

Tim Fulton 18:46Mm-hmm

Travis Irvine 18:46... and Green Party really, you know, you think about it, half of their battles are just getting on the ballot. Because-

Tim Fulton 18:51Right

Travis Irvine 18:51... you know, different states, like, it's hard for the Green Party to get on the ballot because the Democrats are trying to keep them off, you know? It kind of works both ways. So the first battle is to get the 54,000 valid signatures. You usually gotta turn in, like, 70,000 ballot just to be safe for any-

Tim Fulton 19:06Okay

Travis Irvine 19:06... technicalities. We're right now, we just crossed the 54,000 valid signature threshold-

Tim Fulton 19:11Great

Travis Irvine 19:12... using a tool with the, uh, secretary of state's office, and we have 80,000 raw. So we're in the home stretch, but we're hoping to get, you know, this last at least 10,000 if not 15 valid to turn in. And then once those are turned in in August of this year, then I have to get 50 signatures of unaffiliated voters, not with any political party, uh, to get on the ballot for governor, and that all needs to be authorized by a secretary of state who does not want the Libertarians on the ballot in any way, Mr. Jon Husted. So, uh-

Tim Fulton 19:44Who is also running to be the-

Travis Irvine 19:45He's trying to be the lieutenant governor.

Tim Fulton 19:46Right.

Travis Irvine 19:47Yeah. So it is a process. It is a huge process. If we're successful by August, then we'll have a good time. Then we'll just go into campaign mode and, and do the, do what I usually do.

Tim Fulton 19:57But you think it is all farming until that point?

Travis Irvine 20:00I mean, it's just all uncertain. I mean, we could turn in the 54,000 signatures, and they could find a technicality just, you know, they could make one up. That's what they did with Charlie Earl when he turned in his 1,200 valid signatures to get on the ballot for governor. He needed to have 500. The technicality that the Republicans got was that our signature gatherers didn't disclose their employment information, which is, like, a technicality that's never been enforced before, but they managed to pull that off. And, and they refused-

Tim Fulton 20:26So the argument being these folks were paid to collect signatures-

Travis Irvine 20:30Yeah

Tim Fulton 20:31... and they didn't upfront disclose to anyone that they were paid.

Travis Irvine 20:35Something like that. It's, it's some technicality, again, that's just never, never been enforced. And the way they were able to do it, the Supreme Court case is, is, you know, stupidly fascinating, where the Republicans found a guy who was registered Libertarian, paid for his lawsuit to sue the LPO over the signatures to say they're not valid. These bills went up to the hundreds of thousands of dollars. The Republicans were secretly paying those bills, and this guy was called by one of the Supreme Court justices a guileless dupe in a plot basically to kick Charlie Earl off the ballot.

Tim Fulton 21:09But still it was passed.

Travis Irvine 21:11It was, uh, yeah. I mean, it, the court case would've dragged out past the 2014 election-

Tim Fulton 21:16Okay

Travis Irvine 21:16... if, if Charlie Earl's campaign had chosen to keep going with it, so it was irrelevant by September.

Tim Fulton 21:21Got it.

Travis Irvine 21:21Yeah.

Tim Fulton 21:21And not to... There is another sort of barrier of entry for you. At this point, you are not the candidate for the Libertarian Party.

Travis Irvine 21:28That's, yes. Thank you. We need more barriers to run for office in this country.

Tim Fulton 21:31Sorry, there are three now. Right.

Travis Irvine 21:33There are now 15? I've lost count. I need to win the straw poll at the Libertarian Party of Ohio's convention, state convention.

Tim Fulton 21:40As of this recording-

Travis Irvine 21:41Yes. It's, uh, yeah, it won't be official till three months before the general election, which will be August, early August.

Tim Fulton 21:46And so then what do you believe happens?

Travis Irvine 21:48Well, uh-

Tim Fulton 21:49'Cause you said then, then you do what you do.

Travis Irvine 21:51Yeah. I do my campaign thing.

Tim Fulton 21:53What is that?

Travis Irvine 21:53I wanna visit all 88 counties.

Tim Fulton 21:55Okay.

Travis Irvine 21:55I just want to... You know, the nice thing is with the primary, you kind of got Cordray and DeWine, who are both very boring, predictable political candidates. And, you know, there's gonna be spillover. Usually Libertarians get spillover from guys, uh, folks who are, like, disappointed that Kucinich didn't get the nomination, right? Like, we'll, we'll get, we'll go to the left on criminal justice reform with Cordray, basically. That's kind of Libertarians go. You legalize marijuana, you, uh, let nonviolent drug offenders out of prison. You give them their voting rights back. End the death penalty. That's, uh, you know.

Tim Fulton 22:25Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 22:25So progressives like those things about Libertarians. And then I got Mary Taylor's people who are all scared of Mike DeWine and his gun control, and so we're gonna also pull in probably a lot of pro-gun, pro-Second Amendment voters, so-

Tim Fulton 22:37You literally are getting the far left-

Travis Irvine 22:39And the far right

Tim Fulton 22:40... and the far right.

Travis Irvine 22:41That's the people who tend to show up for Libertarian elections, yes.

Tim Fulton 22:44What's the relationship with the Green Party at this point then?

Travis Irvine 22:47The Libertarians and the Green?

Tim Fulton 22:48Yeah.

Travis Irvine 22:48I mean, I know, I do know their governor candidate, Connie Gladwell Newton.

Tim Fulton 22:52Yeah.

Travis Irvine 22:52She's a very nice lady.

Tim Fulton 22:53I've seen her at-

Travis Irvine 22:54Great attorney

Tim Fulton 22:54... debates. Yeah.

Travis Irvine 22:55Yeah. And, uh, but no, beyond that, I mean, we're just in the same race in that I hope they get 3%, and hopefully they hope we get 3%, you know? Hopefully Cordray and DeWine are so boring that people actually show up and vote for minor political parties because this is, in Ohio, it is now worth it, you know? We do need that crucial 3% to even give you another option on the ballot for the next four years.

Tim Fulton 23:17I guess the thing that's disconcerting to me is this will continue to be a fight.

Travis Irvine 23:21Mm-hmm.

Tim Fulton 23:21And it will continue to-

Travis Irvine 23:23Every four years, unless we overturn SB 193 somehow.

Tim Fulton 23:27Which is unlikely given the makeup of the state legislature.

Travis Irvine 23:31Well, yeah, I guess so.

Tim Fulton 23:34And so to be absolutely clear, you intend to run for governor.

Travis Irvine 23:39Yes.

Tim Fulton 23:39You don't intend to win.

Travis Irvine 23:42Well, you never know. The minimum goal is 3%.

Tim Fulton 23:45Okay.

Travis Irvine 23:45But hopefully you get way more than that, obviously.

Tim Fulton 23:46And so do you believe, given the conversations that you've had with folks at the Libertarian Party, that you are being brought on literally simply to drum up enough support? They don't have higher goals than-

Travis Irvine 24:01Well, I mean, no, I wouldn't... I mean-

Tim Fulton 24:03They'd love to see 5%, obviously.

Travis Irvine 24:04They would love to see 5, yeah.

Tim Fulton 24:05But nothing hap- nothing happens then.

Travis Irvine 24:06Yeah, yeah.

Tim Fulton 24:07They don't get another two years added to it.

Travis Irvine 24:09No, they don't. I guess you're right, yeah.

Tim Fulton 24:10Okay.

Travis Irvine 24:11Yeah. So we gotta meet the technicality of 3% minimum. And the reason, yeah, they tapped me is because I've run for office before, I've done this before, and I've gotten them what they needed before. So yeah, all of those factors lead into it.

Tim Fulton 24:23And again, in the past, you've only been an endorsed candidate, not the actual candidate for the party.

Travis Irvine 24:28You mean for governor or-

Tim Fulton 24:30So, yeah, no, for the mayor's race, for-

Travis Irvine 24:32Right

Tim Fulton 24:32... and it was actually only for Congress that you were an endorsed candidate, right?

Travis Irvine 24:34Yeah, because the Bexley mayor's race is nonpartisan. I just got... Actually, that was a fascinating race. If you see the documentary American Mayor on Amazon Prime, available now, go loop it.

Tim Fulton 24:432 cents every time.

Travis Irvine 24:432 cents every month. I was endorsed by the Franklin County Libertarian Party and the Central Ohio Green Party when I ran for mayor of Bexley. So there you go. Two, I think the joke was two fringe political parties came together for one very fringe candidate, as we like to say. And I ran against seven other people for Bexley mayor, so getting 5% in that race was actually a pretty big deal, except when you actually look at how many people voted. I got, like, 200 votes. You know, the 18-year-old kid got, like, 46 votes.

Tim Fulton 25:11So and there were, i- in terms of the rank, you were not last place among those seven.

Travis Irvine 25:15No, I was sixth place, yeah.

Tim Fulton 25:17You only beat the high school kid?

Travis Irvine 25:19No, I beat the gay guy and the high school kid. Bexley apparently very anti-gay. I could not believe it.

Tim Fulton 25:24Apparently.

Travis Irvine 25:25Yeah. 'Cause they voted, they voted for me over... I mean, I, anyway. I had dreadlocks. I was living with my parents. It wasn't the best choices.

Tim Fulton 25:32It wasn't the best campaign.

Travis Irvine 25:33Yeah. I should've, I should grow my dreadlocks back, though, I think.

Tim Fulton 25:36You think?

Travis Irvine 25:37Yeah. Well, I also had dreadlocks-

Tim Fulton 25:38I think if I did a s-

Travis Irvine 25:38... when I ran for Congress, remember? Two times in my life I've been a white guy with dreadlocks, and I am sorry for that. Um, I did not learn my lesson the first time, but also both of those times-

Tim Fulton 25:48I ran for election

Travis Irvine 25:49... I r- I was running for office, and we made videos where I cut my hair, and I was like, "This is what I'm gonna do to the federal budget." It was great. I mean, libertarians loved it, but you get the idea.

Tim Fulton 26:00I do. So along those lines, what happens after August? What are... You're gonna tour all 88 counties.

Travis Irvine 26:06I would love to visit all 88 counties, and our strength of the campaigns that I've, I've run and been a part of, and then my own, it has always been earned media. We make these videos, these campaign videos that are not overly jokey, but they're fun and entertaining because political videos can be pretty boring or nasty, and so we kind of bring, like, a fresh, creative take on it. Very positive. You always stay, you know. It's very easy, honestly. I remember going door to door, the Libertarian race, just b- being like, "Are you Republican or Democrat?" I'm like, "I'm not either. I'm sick of both of them." They're like, "Give me that flyer." Right? That's usually, you know, I- most people identify as independent, you know? That's-

Tim Fulton 26:42Right

Travis Irvine 26:42... what makes Ohio the swingiest of all the, the swing states.

Tim Fulton 26:45That's what they say.

Travis Irvine 26:46That's what they say. So our videos, when I ran for mayor of Bexley, 2007, 2009, Jay Leno put my jingle that we made, he put it on The Jay Leno Show, not on The Tonight Show. It was the worst... I mean, unless, of course, I get on his garage show with all the cars. It was technically the worst Jay Leno show that ever existed. But it was a segment called Elected or Not Elected, and they showed five kinda like fun, wacky, straight, some straight-up kooky campaign ads, and then the crowd would vote elected or not elected. And I remember Jay Leno specifically said, um, "This guy, uh, shouldn't be, uh, writing jingles and should just be, uh, running for office. I love that song. I love that song." That's what he did. That's my Jay Leno. Oh, I got a bobblehead. I got a bobblehead. I forgot.

Tim Fulton 27:29He loved it.

Travis Irvine 27:29He loved it. So that was the mayor campaign. And then when I ran for Congress in Lib- 2010, we had a, an ad called Give the Two-Party System the Third Finger, which you may recall.

Tim Fulton 27:38I do.

Travis Irvine 27:38And, um, is it... You guys are gonna love this. This is just classic stuff. Again, you, you talk about the two parties, how they've let everybody down. The two-party system is, is broken, so it's time to give the two-party system the third finger. And you hold up the ring finger, not the middle finger. I remember we used to do this in, like, third grade, and, like, people would be like, "Whoa!" And it's like, "No, no, I'm not flicking you off. It's, it's just the ring finger." So we had a bunch of people doing that to the camera, and we raised enough money to put it on TV, so it became an actual campaign ad. And then sure enough, the weekend before the election in 2010, PBS NewsHour had a, a segment on campaign ads. They called us one of the most clever campaign ads of the season. Um, and that was the year where they also had h- John Hickenlooper from Colorado taking a shower every time he saw a negative ad, so that one's kinda fun. And then, of course, Clara... God, what was it? I think Christine O'Donnell in Delaware.

Tim Fulton 28:28Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 28:28The, the, uh, woman who's like, "I'm not a witch." She let, she had to inform people that she's not a witch in her campaign ads. So we were featured in a segment about fun campaign ads. And then I, apparently we were on Anderson Cooper as well, but he was not as amused by the video. And that-

Tim Fulton 28:44He's a serious man.

Travis Irvine 28:45What's that?

Tim Fulton 28:45He's a serious man.

Travis Irvine 28:46He's a very serious guy. Yeah.

Tim Fulton 28:47Right.

Travis Irvine 28:47Why would he? But it was, you know, that's what we do. And then, you know, 2014, Tim and I, full disclosure, because I was very upset about the Libertarians getting kicked off the ballot, and so I just wanted to make fun of John Kasich. I started up a, um, statewide PAC here in Ohio called Central Ohioans Countering Kasich.

Tim Fulton 29:05Also known as...

Travis Irvine 29:06COCK. You can do the math. And we had a lot of fun with that. We just made fun of Kasich for the whole election. And because Ed Fitzgerald's c- campaign imploded by September, we started getting more press.

Tim Fulton 29:17We got a lot, like, so-

Travis Irvine 29:19Like, a lot of press

Tim Fulton 29:19... again, full disclosure, I was the treasurer of this organization.

Travis Irvine 29:22You were the deputy. I, I was the treasurer.

Tim Fulton 29:23I was the deputy? Is that what I was?

Travis Irvine 29:24Yeah, I did all the accounting.

Tim Fulton 29:25Here's the-

Travis Irvine 29:26My g-

Tim Fulton 29:26... the worrisome thing. Uh, my home address was at the bottom of every ad.

Travis Irvine 29:29That was a mistake that we should not have... We should use an office.

Tim Fulton 29:32We should've gotten one.

Travis Irvine 29:33But you can't, you're not allowed to use a PO box, so-

Tim Fulton 29:34Right

Travis Irvine 29:35... I appreciated you doing that.

Tim Fulton 29:35I offered that up.

Travis Irvine 29:36Yeah.

Tim Fulton 29:37Up. At one point, it was, like, my office, like, my, like, work's office, but I didn't feel comfortable telling them, you know-

Travis Irvine 29:43Yeah

Tim Fulton 29:43... "Hey, I am associated with this anti-Kasich political action committee."

Travis Irvine 29:48Yeah.

Tim Fulton 29:48"Is it okay?" And they're like, "What's it called?" Yeah, you can just use my home address.

Travis Irvine 29:54Just COCK, just spell it out.

Tim Fulton 29:55Right.

Travis Irvine 29:55Yeah, you don't have to... Yeah.

Tim Fulton 29:57What was it, cockpac.org?

Travis Irvine 29:59It was cockpac.org.

Tim Fulton 30:00Yeah.

Travis Irvine 30:00That's what it was. And one of my favorites was we got on On the Record, the, uh, W- OSU show-

Tim Fulton 30:06Mm-hmm

Travis Irvine 30:06... hosted by Mike Thompson, and they showed an ad, 'cause Kasich put out an ad called He Listened, which featured a cop who basically said, "Kasich listened to us when we repealed SB5, and we moved on, and he's a great guy," basically.

Tim Fulton 30:20Well, and also the intention of that was something that we had pointed out, that he It's my favorite freeway exit in the state. He was pulled over by a police officer-

Travis Irvine 30:32Yes

Tim Fulton 30:33... going north on 315. He ended up being pulled over right after-

Travis Irvine 30:37I thought he was just driving against traffic. That's like how dumb John Kasich is.

Tim Fulton 30:40No, he just, he w- he was going the speed limit close to a pulled-over cop car.

Travis Irvine 30:44Oh, you're supposed to change lanes.

Tim Fulton 30:45You're supposed to change lanes.

Travis Irvine 30:46Yeah.

Tim Fulton 30:46You're supposed to get away. And he ended up getting pulled over right after the Hudson and 315 north, excuse me, Henderson and 315 north exit. And-

Travis Irvine 30:58How do you know so much about-

Tim Fulton 31:00Because I love-

Travis Irvine 31:00... being pulled over?

Tim Fulton 31:02I just love that exit.

Travis Irvine 31:03Yeah, okay.

Tim Fulton 31:03And he then, in speeches, would talk about how crazy, he would use this as an analogy for regulation.

Travis Irvine 31:14Yeah.

Tim Fulton 31:14And say-

Travis Irvine 31:15Well, he called the cop-

Tim Fulton 31:16He, it was stopped

Travis Irvine 31:17... an, an idiot.

Tim Fulton 31:18Exactly.

Travis Irvine 31:19Yeah. He was just like-

Tim Fulton 31:20He was-

Travis Irvine 31:20He went around, and he was just berating this cop who pulled him over in public

Tim Fulton 31:22It was his stump speech to literally be, "Can you guys believe I was pulled over?"

Travis Irvine 31:27Oh, you gotta do full Kasich. Colin, you gotta scrunch your face.

Tim Fulton 31:30Okay.

Travis Irvine 31:30And you gotta kinda like hunch your shoulders, and then like flap your arms.

Tim Fulton 31:33Like this.

Travis Irvine 31:34It's like, yeah, "He's an idiot." And then you just do that.

Tim Fulton 31:36That's the John K Sucks.

Travis Irvine 31:38That's the John K Sucks dance-

Tim Fulton 31:39Which we'll get-

Travis Irvine 31:39... which we also orchestrated with Cockpack.

Tim Fulton 31:42Right.

Travis Irvine 31:43Yeah.

Tim Fulton 31:43By the way, it is John K Sucks because if he had presented himself as John Kasich, there was a belief that Travis or, frankly, me, would get sued.

Travis Irvine 31:53Yeah.

Tim Fulton 31:54And so we ended up having-

Travis Irvine 31:55It was just, like, murky. We were, just weren't sure about the legal territory there.

Tim Fulton 31:57We had to be careful.

Travis Irvine 31:58Yeah.

Tim Fulton 31:58And so it's basically John K Sucks is obviously parody, and so there you go.

Travis Irvine 32:02Yeah, yeah.

Tim Fulton 32:03But yeah, literally this event, he was pulled over by a police officer, totally valid reason. It was actually based on the safety of other police officers.

Travis Irvine 32:11Right.

Tim Fulton 32:12And part of his stump speech ended up being, "Can you believe these people pulled me over?" And he over and over and over again said, "He's an idiot."

Travis Irvine 32:22Yeah, yeah. So that's what our video-

Tim Fulton 32:24It was handed to us

Travis Irvine 32:25... that's what our video made fun of. We just, we got, uh, my friend who's an actor to play a cop, and he just focused on, uh, how John Kasich called him an idiot, basically. And this is the one that got on W- WOSU's On the Record. You know, 'cause at, at that point, again, Fitzgerald's campaign was, like, toast, so they put it on-

Tim Fulton 32:40So they needed something to talk about-

Travis Irvine 32:42They needed something

Tim Fulton 32:42... in terms of the election, right

Travis Irvine 32:43Yeah, we were giving them, we were just churning out anti-John Kasich content while everyone else was falling flat, so. And I remember the Republican commentator they had on the show, it was so funny because I wanted them to say our name. It was so bad. I was just like, "Come on, say it."

Tim Fulton 32:58Say it.

Travis Irvine 32:58Like, "It's put out by a, a group here, uh, out of central Ohio." You know, they were so close.

Tim Fulton 33:03They're a, uh-

Travis Irvine 33:04They were so close

Tim Fulton 33:04... political action committee that seems to be against Governor John Kasich.

Travis Irvine 33:08Yeah, and I remember the Republican guy was just like, "Yeah, I don't know if that's..." 'Cause it, you know, we got, like, thousands of views on YouTube within, you know, a day or two. But the Republican guy was like, "I don't know if that's really gonna do anything. It's, it's run by some kid out of New York who works for Obama and MoveOn.org." Because it highlights my time when I liked Obama, and I was trying to make videos for MoveOn.org, so.

Tim Fulton 33:29Right. Well, and it's easy to-

Travis Irvine 33:31To do that. It's easy to paint it that way, yeah

Tim Fulton 33:32... especially for someone like you. And I think that that's what's gonna be interesting with the gubernatorial race is they are going to be able to point to... Well, I did it super quick, affiliated with Roger Stone.

Travis Irvine 33:45Yes.

Tim Fulton 33:45Affiliated with Gary Johnson.

Travis Irvine 33:47Yes.

Tim Fulton 33:47That's not a bad thing considering-

Travis Irvine 33:49Those things are good with Trump voters and then also Gary Johnson people.

Tim Fulton 33:54Right.

Travis Irvine 33:54Yeah.

Tim Fulton 33:55But also, like, your work with the Vice network.

Travis Irvine 33:58Right, which was all pro Bernie Sanders, basically.

Tim Fulton 34:01Okay.

Travis Irvine 34:01A lot of my videos were blatantly pro.

Tim Fulton 34:04Are you worried about being discredited?

Travis Irvine 34:06What? I think I've done that enough myself. They don't need to do it for me. Good grief. I mean, look, again, I've been politically independent. I mean, I was kinda raised Democrat, but you know, I think after the Bush-Cheney years, what turned me on to libertarianism, uh, was this guy Ron Paul, who inspired a bunch of millennials to be more libertarian.

Tim Fulton 34:26Mm-hmm.

Travis Irvine 34:27'Cause he was basically an anti-war, pro civil liberties Republican in the 2008 debates.

Tim Fulton 34:32Right.

Travis Irvine 34:32And he got in a big, uh, back and forth with Rudy Giuliani about 9/11 and, you know, whether it made us safer or, you know, s- 'cause they were cracking down on all the, the civil liberties.

Tim Fulton 34:42Right.

Travis Irvine 34:42And so he, you know, he voted against the Patriot Act, just like Dennis Kucinich and Russ Feingold. It's the, it's kind of fun-

Tim Fulton 34:48I think it was, it was four total, right?

Travis Irvine 34:50What's that?

Tim Fulton 34:51In the House that voted against?

Travis Irvine 34:52Yeah, I think so.

Tim Fulton 34:53Yeah.

Travis Irvine 34:53It was very low, and Russ Feingold was the only guy in the Senate. And you know, it's this interesting crossover that I really do think is the future of at least millennial politics is, are these areas where progressives and libertarians agree. I mean, when I was campaigning with Gary Johnson in 2016, we had a lot of Bernie people showing up because we're all anti-war, we're pro civil liberties, we're pro criminal justice reform, pro marijuana legalization. That seems to unite a lot of people, I've found, um-

Tim Fulton 35:16Yeah

Travis Irvine 35:17... at parties and stuff like that, so. But, um, but you know-

Tim Fulton 35:20When you're, when you're out talking to people.

Travis Irvine 35:22Yeah, you know, hanging out, pressing the flesh, shaking hands, kissing babies, as you do.

Tim Fulton 35:26There's some concern, especially given how the last presidential election went, that who you're gonna be drawing folks away from.

Travis Irvine 35:35Mm-hmm.

Tim Fulton 35:36And we've talked about, you know, you have potential Kucinich voters. We have potential Mary Taylor voters.

Travis Irvine 35:41Right.

Tim Fulton 35:41What will your focus or intention be, and, like, are you worried about that? Because y- again, you don't intend on winning.

Travis Irvine 35:49Well, we're gonna try.

Tim Fulton 35:50Sorry.

Travis Irvine 35:50You always have to try, Tim.

Tim Fulton 35:51I'm sorry. You don't expect-

Travis Irvine 35:53Come on. This is campaign 101.

Tim Fulton 35:54Let me rephrase it. You-

Travis Irvine 35:54The goal is to win, but also 3%.

Tim Fulton 35:58You're, you don't expect to win is, is-

Travis Irvine 36:00You gotta stop asking me that. I expect to win outright.

Tim Fulton 36:04Okay.

Travis Irvine 36:04And then challenge the election results immediately.

Tim Fulton 36:08Great.

Travis Irvine 36:09Just like William Buckley would've done.

Tim Fulton 36:10Are you worried about the implications of either candidate?

Travis Irvine 36:16No. With Gary Johnson specifically in Ohio, he got 3% of the vote, which technically, again, thanks to SB 193, he was not on the ballot as a Libertarian. He was on the ballot as an Independent, so that did not count towards ballot access for the next four years. It should've, but it didn't But Trump won Ohio by 8%. I mean, it wasn't even close. So, you know, espe- especially in Ohio, I don't think I will be taking votes away from either can- I think that 3% exists as is under the current landscape. It'll be the Democrats' job to get, you know, more points than Mike DeWine, really. I would just add to that, I mean, the goal is, it always has to be to win. You always have to, when you go into any election, you have to work to win, and we're going to, you know, double digits would be great. But, you know, if you look at Ross Perot, I remember Ross Perot. I was the only kid that voted for Ross Perot in, uh, my third grade election. Not election-

Tim Fulton 37:10Third grade straw poll

Travis Irvine 37:11... yeah, third grade straw poll. And, I mean, uh, Ross Perot got 19% of the popular vote. You know, we fought the same battle with Gary Johnson. When these candidates, if Jill Stein and Gary Johnson had been in all the televised debates with Trump and Clinton, they would've definitely pulled more votes. That's what you saw with Ross Perot in '92, because he was in those debates. That's why he got so much traction in the general. And if he had had a better organized campaign, he probably would've exceeded the 19% that he got.

Tim Fulton 37:38I wanna finish off just with we're a week and a half away from the primaries. Do you have any reflections on how things sort of worked out?

Travis Irvine 37:47Yeah, I think they worked out in our favor, because I think the Toledo Blade had a great editorial. It was about boring may prevail in the, in the gubernatorial race, and, you know, Cordray, DeWine are both, you know, mainstream, moderate, exactly what you would expect-

Tim Fulton 38:01Mm

Travis Irvine 38:01... from a, you know, from boring politics. So I think it worked out in our favor. And I do think, yeah, the Kucinich people are gonna be looking for an alternative, and the Mary Taylor people are gonna be looking for an alternative. And, you know, and you and I have talked before about it's not necessarily pro-pot, pro-guns, it's pro-rights. It's pro people having these rights-

Tim Fulton 38:17Right

Travis Irvine 38:17... to use these things properly as civilized adults. So, but it is kind of fun that the Libertarian Party does have this knack to be, uh, "I support the right of married gay couples to guard their pot plants with AK-47s." And it's just like, who does that appeal to?

Tim Fulton 38:32The voter picks and chooses at that point.

Travis Irvine 38:34Exactly.

Tim Fulton 38:34And they hear what they wanna hear.

Travis Irvine 38:36Yeah. And you know, honestly, the other fascinating thing, 'cause I've been at this for, like, 10 years, and, you know, and it happened to me, was that a lot of people are Libertarian, they just kinda don't know it. And then there's always some issues, like, you know, I actually do think the environment needs to be protected by laws, so that's an area where I differ with fellow Libertarians. But-

Tim Fulton 38:53Right

Travis Irvine 38:53... you know, you, you have that within any political party, as the recent primary showed.

Tim Fulton 38:57Yeah. Well, and we talked about how, you know, as someone who was raised Quaker, you know, could be a Libertarian. You're just happy to be-

Travis Irvine 39:05I still don't believe that you were... I think you were just raised on Quaker Oats. The cereal.

Tim Fulton 39:09No, I was raised Quaker.

Travis Irvine 39:10Okay.

Tim Fulton 39:11On that note-

Travis Irvine 39:11Yeah

Tim Fulton 39:12... ladies and gentlemen, a round of applause for Travis Irvine.

Travis Irvine 39:14Oh, hey. Was that an hour already?

Tim Fulton 39:16That was 45.

Travis Irvine 39:1745 minutes?

Tim Fulton 39:18Yeah.

Travis Irvine 39:18Boy, we are good at gabbin'.

Tim Fulton 39:20We are, you are very good at it.

Travis Irvine 39:21No, you're good at gabbin'.

Tim Fulton 39:22No, you.

Travis Irvine 39:22No, you. Hey, let's hear it for the Columbus Podcast Festival, everybody. This is, this has been really fun.

Tim Fulton 39:28Thank you, Travis.

Travis Irvine 39:29Thank you, Tim.

Tim Fulton 39:39Thank you for listening to the Confluence Cast, presented by Columbus Underground. Again, you can get more information on what Travis and I discussed today in the show notes for this episode at theconfluencecast.com. Please rate, subscribe, share this episode of the Confluence Cast with your friends, family, contacts, enemies, your favorite politician. If you're interested in sponsoring the Confluence Cast, get in touch with us. We can be reached by email at info@theconfluencecast.com. Our theme music was composed by Benji Robinson. Our producer is Philip Cogley. I'm your host, Tim Fulton. Have a great week.